topic Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing in Full Fibre

New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Thu, 21 Nov 2024 17:41:37 GMT

New installation of Fibre 900 today with two Eero Pro 6 boxes.

All set up and working, speed from the main box is great, getting 938 Mbps download and 108 Mbps upload according to the apps speed test.

However the wifi is a different story altogether. Using my iPhone 16 Pro, if I stand next to the main router I get approx 590ish, as I walk away from it, it just keeps dropping until its getting around 100-150ish.

I have the other Eero box upstairs in the closest available space, quite open, just a couple of walls between the main Eero router. (New build house, walls are not very thick)

Even upstairs, standing next to the second Eero the speed is about 160. If I plug my PC into the second box I get speeds of about 550 Mbps.

I've updated both to the latest software as notified in the app.

Very disappointed with it, would appreciate any help!

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Thu, 21 Nov 2024 21:14:22 GMT

Just to add to this, I've just been reading about others who have had very similar issues that were caused by the 5ghz channels being too high for devices. Both my 5ghz channels are 42 & 155.

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

Anonymous — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 06:44:00 GMT

Morning,

Can you please update your community profile to include your:

Name
Telephone number or Account number
Alternative contact number

We'll then look into this further. Please do not post this information on this thread. Once you've updated your profile please post in your topic to confirm it's updated.

Thanks

Michelle

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 07:25:47 GMT

Hi Michelle

I've updated the details for you.

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

Anonymous — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 07:41:35 GMT

Hello,

Do you also have a FTTP number? Can you also add this to your Community Profile please?

Thanks

Michelle

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 07:53:51 GMT

Sorry, I can't seem to find the Fttp number.

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

Anonymous — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 07:57:14 GMT

Hi,

No problem. I'm just looking into this for you and will post back shortly with an update.

Thanks

Michelle

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

Anonymous — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 09:59:27 GMT

Hello again,

Our team have made a change. Could you retest and let us know if there are any changes in speed please?

Thanks

Michelle

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 10:52:17 GMT

Have tried again using the iPhone and Fast.com

Main Router -

standing within a meter - 750 - 950

3 meters away - 880

6 metres (halfway upstairs) - 760

10 metres upstairs, next to other router - 230

Furthest point away from main router - 120

Test in reverse, starting at upstairs router (turned wifi off phone and back on again)

next to router - 250

halfway downstairs - 220

entering room of main router - 170

next to main router - nothing

Ethernet to PC from second (upstairs) router - 800-880

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 13:45:03 GMT

So the main router is improved, but it seems the second router is still not that great on Wifi, strange as connecting the same router to PC via ethernet I'm getting great speeds.

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

Anonymous — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 13:47:43 GMT

Good afternoon,

I'm sorry for the delay. Thanks for confirming. @KeithFrench would you be able to offer any additional advice on the wireless speeds please?

Thanks

Michelle

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

KeithFrench — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 14:50:46 GMT

Hi @tallsmall

@Anonymous has asked me to help you with this issue. The point about devices not being able to connect to high 5GHz channels such as 155 should not be an issue with the eero Pro 6, as it also has the low 5GHz band as well. However, the 5GHz high is twice as fast on the eero than the low band.

The Full Fibre 500 or 900 packages often mean that customers do not achieve the speeds they think they should (obviously, around 500 or 900Mbps). This is often not an issue or design of these services, but the connection between their devices and the router. The Wi-Fi network adapters in these devices often cannot deliver speeds as fast as the fibre service can.

Take the example of some older Wi-Fi 5 (802.11ac) adapters that might work at speeds up to 433Mbps, when used in a perfect wireless environment, which most homes are not. When an internet speed test is performed, the speed achieved is down to the slowest link in the chain, namely the 433Mbps Wi-Fi adapter. Speed tests in this case might achieve somewhere around 400Mbps or less.

Older Ethernet connections can suffer as well. If a device only supports the 10/100Mbps standard, not the normal 1000M (1Gbps) or even the newer 2.5Gbps available on some desktop PCs, they are likely to only record 100Mbps on a speed test.

To get close to the 500/900Mbps on a speed test, that device must either have a minimum of a 1Gbps Ethernet connection or if wireless, a much faster WiFi adapter. This would be a higher specification Wi-Fi 5 (802.11ac) or Wi-Fi 6 (802.11ax) adapter. Even so, at these wireless speeds, signal quality must be near perfect (signal strength with very little Wi-Fi interference).

There are some basic checks that you can do to ensure that your devices have the best chance of achieving these higher speeds:-

1) Check that these devices are connected to the 5GHz WiFi band, not the 2.4GHz band and as you presumably have the eero Pro 6, then as many devices as possible should be using the 5GHz (High) band.

2) Which eero Pro 6 is each device connected to, it should always be the gateway or closest/fastest extender node. The more extender nodes that you go through to get to the gateway, the slower the speed will always be. In fact, you will probably need to be connected to the gateway to have any chance of these speeds. In addition to this, with the eero Pro 6, any device capable of a 2402Mbps link speed must be connected to the 5GHz (High) wi-fi band. The 5GHz (Low) band is not as high a specification as the high one.

3) To aid with step 2, is "Client Steering" enabled within the eero app, as well as "Local DNS Caching"?

4) Have you checked for WiFi interference, a topic that I can provide a lot of help with?

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 15:17:39 GMT

Hi Keith

Thanks for the great reply, very informative.

I do have a mixture of old and new tech that is currently connected to the new setup, and appreciate that old network adaptors will not be able to achieve the higher speeds. I am using a new iPhone 16 pro as my fixed benchmarking device for my tests.

1 - I cannot seem to find a way on the app to see what frequency each individual device is connected to. I can see what router it is connected to, but not the attached frequency. I'm not what the wifi radio analytics shows.

2 - From my results, if I start close to the main router I get excellent speeds that quickly go down as I approach the second eero box. However if i turn wifi off/on again whilst standing next to the second box, the initial speed is greatly reduced and goes down to next to nothing, even when approaching the main router, like the phone isnt switching over.

3 - Client steering is/was enabled, but Local DNS wasnt. I have just enabled it.

4 - For wifi interference I have used both Windows analyzer on my android phone and my upstairs PC. Apart from my devices I cannot see any other congestion. (We live in a small old village, detached house, at the end of a cul-de-sac, there are only a couple of hours nearby)

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

KeithFrench — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 15:38:04 GMT

Hi @tallsmall

What are the WiFI specifications of this iPhone?

I am sure that the app used to make it very easy to identify which WiFi band a device was connected to, but in later updates of the app or eeroOs, this is not quite as easy. It is easy to see which eero a device is connected, but not which band. However, if you tap on the Devices tab then scroll across the filter options until you get to Connection Type, select 5GHz & tap the Done button. This will then display a list of all devices connected to the 5GHz band, but does not differentiate between the low & high 5GHz bands. Then untick that & replace it with the 2.4GHz button, to see those connected to the 2.4GHz band.

The same can be displayed via the Filter option & selecting Connection Type from there.

The best way, though, is to always use the device to tell you which WiFi band & channel it is currently connected to. This of course depends on whether that device will display such information or not. MS Windows is by far the easiest to tell, Android is not too bad, as is MacOS. However, I do not know about iPhone's as I do not have one.

When connecting to an extender eero, you have to factor in losses over the wireless backhaul network that transports the IP pockets from the device, via the extender to the gateway eero. The fastest will always be to use a Cat 6 minimum ethernet backhaul, but in most cases the WiFi one is fine.

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 15:50:07 GMT

WIFI specs for the iPhone 16 Pro (from Apple website) are -

5G (sub‑6GHz) with 4x4 MIMO
Gigabit LTE with 4x4 MIMO and LAA
Wi‑Fi 7 (802.11be) with 2x2 MIMO
Bluetooth 5.3
Second-generation Ultra Wideband chip
Thread networking technology
NFC with reader mode
Express Cards with Power Reserve

From using the filer options (great tip btw, simply did not see it!), the majority of my devices, the ones I care about, are connected to the 5ghz.

I will be getting some powerline adapters & ethernet switch for my work room, which has my PC, PS5 and Xbox Series X, as this is where i need as much speed as possible.

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

KeithFrench — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 16:25:52 GMT

Hi @tallsmall

Thanks, I'll work through those over the weekend & get back to you.

The Connection Type used to be shown when tapping on a Device, but as I said it is missing now. I have just raised this with eero support, to see if it can be re-instated & enhanced where the eero Po 6 & above are concerned. Previously when a device was connected to the Pro 6's 5GHz band, it did not differentiate between the low & high bands. I have requested that they improve it to show exactly which of the three radios the device is connected to.

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Fri, 22 Nov 2024 16:34:27 GMT

Thank you, really do appreciate your time helping me.

The WiFi from the main router has improved with the tweaks made so far, it's the second router that's puzzling me, especially connecting an ethernet cable to it, the speed is great to my PC, about 800-900.

It's obviously taking in a strong WiFi signal from the main router, it's just not sending it out with the same strength to other devices.

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

KeithFrench — Sat, 23 Nov 2024 10:51:30 GMT

Hi @tallsmall

You should be able to get very good speeds as your iPhone supports WiFi 7, OK it will max out at WiFi 6 with a top theoretical link speed of 1201Mbps on the 5GHz low band & 2401Mbps on the 5GHz High band, depending on the fastest speeds that the phone supports. I say theoretical, because it all depends on levels of WiFi interference & location, you may not get close to these sometimes. Then there are a lot of overheads with WiFi reducing the actual throughput further.

What I have found with the eero 6 and it will apply equally to the Pro 6, as you have no manual control of the WiFi channels in use, location of both eeros and devices is crucial. I know you have said the rooms that the eeros are in, but as much as possible, try to follow my recommendations for the best locations for a router, extender mesh nodes and your devices, but obviously, this is not always practical, and a compromise has to be reached. Where Full Fibre is concerned, the router connected to the ONT can easily be moved to a better location via a longer Cat 6 minimum, Ethernet cable. I know in your case you get good speeds from the gateway eero, but its location should be optimal as well.

The general rule is do not keep them in a cupboard, but out in the open and sited as high & centrally within the property. Keep them away from:-

Cordless phone (DECT) base stations
TVs
Loudspeakers & any sub-woofers (including those used with a PC)
Computer monitors
Electrical appliances – they often transmit their own signals that can interfere with Wi-Fi signals.
Bluetooth devices – they operate on the same Wi-Fi frequency as your broadband, which can cause signal problems.
Mirrors – they actually reflect Wi-Fi signals, stopping them from passing through walls and reflecting them back into the room.
Anything containing large amounts of water – things like fish tanks and boilers can absorb Wi-Fi signals like a sponge.
Large metal objects – radiators, for instance, will have the same effect on your Wi-Fi as mirrors. If you have a tower PC case with an internal WiFi card, the metal of the case can block signals to & from the antennae if they are located behind the tower case.
Glass - different types of glass can cause problems for Wi-Fi signals to pass through:-

a) Thick window glass or glazing can block Wi-Fi signals.
b) Low-emissivity (Low-E) windows have a metallic film that can reflect and block Wi-Fi signals more than clear glass.
c) Tinted glass often has a metallic film that can interfere with radio signals.
d) K glass double glazing has a metal vapour coating that can reduce Wi-Fi signal strength by 30-50%.

If you are using a USB Wi-Fi adapter, use a USB socket on the front of the PC, as there is more open space around it than at the rear. If a USB extension cable is used, try to ensure that it is fairly short, so that the power from the computer is not attenuated. Long extension cables can cause the adapter to not have enough power from the computer to work correctly.

Where USB or PCIe-connected WiFi adapters are concerned, power management is best disabled if running in Windows to keep a reliable Wi-Fi connection working at full speed. Once you have made the changes outlined below, it is probably best to restart the PC.

Windows Power Management issues. To check this in Windows 10 or 11, open Device Manager and expand Network adapters. Then right-click your WiFi card & select Properties. Next, click on the Power Management tab and untick Allow the computer to turn off this device to save power. If the adapter is connected via USB, then expand the USB section in Device Manager. The same option can be found in the Power Management tab in most Root Hubs and USB Controllers. Untick it there as well.

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

tallsmall — Sat, 23 Nov 2024 11:11:33 GMT

Thanks again Keith, great reply & info to go through. 🙂

It'll be a struggle to move the main box as it's been installed next to all the equipment and sockets. We haven't really got an ideal more centrally located place to put it that wouldn't entail lots of cables being visible.

For all my main equipment I'm going to be using an ethernet cable solution connected to all my equipment upstairs that really needs the high speed (work PC, PS5 and Xbox). This cable will be connected to my second upstairs eero which supplies great speeds through ethernet, so I'm very happy with that. (I ditched the idea of power line adaptors after reading up on them properly this morning)

It is the puzzle though of why that second box can give great wired speeds out but such poor WiFi. It's obviously getting a very good signal from the main box, it's just not transmitting it out to the other devices, even when stood right next to it, about max of 250-300.

I can't help but think that it's either the box isn't broadcasting a 5ghz signal or stuck in 2.4, or it's maybe faulty?

Re: New Fibre 900 installation, Eero Pro 6 Wifi is really disappointing

KeithFrench — Sat, 23 Nov 2024 11:24:45 GMT

Can you describe as best as you can where the extender eero is upstairs and what is around it in terms of electronic equipment? Just for info, when I moved my gateway eero further away from my ONT, I hid the cables in white plastic self-adhesive trunking.

I can check the WiFi output from both eeros for you easily enough, particularly if the PC you have upstairs is Windows & has a WiFi connection.

Slow speed, intermittent dropouts, breaks in the signal or no signal on some or all devices or no internet access might be caused by Wi-Fi interference from other local networks, which can also lead to a permanent reduction in speed. No ISP can be responsible for your local environment, this is mainly a byproduct of the popularity of Wi-Fi.

Generally speaking, the 2.4GHz band suffers a lot more from interference than the much faster 5GHz band, but the 2.4GHz one can sometimes have a better range, but this all depends on your local area.

In other words, I try to help you optimise your Wi-Fi connection. The next stage involves sending out a guide to you to help you get me some important diagnostic results so that I can analyse them for you and recommend changes to your router configuration to solve them. Whilst the eero is supposed to manage Wi-Fi interference, if this is very bad, particularly in the 2.4GHz band, then it cannot do anything about it, no router can. The same goes for any router at that point.

Do not worry about interpreting the results, I will do that for you. I will send a PM to you that contains a link for a guide of mine on Wi-Fi interference. It is quite long (about 30 pages), but you will probably only need to look at three or four pages in total. Initially look at the section called "Are you suffering from interference – prove it first". This is the first link in the table of contents. This section includes full details of free Wi-Fi analysers that I recommend for Windows, Windows phone, Android and Apple operating systems. However, I have no way of testing the Apple product. Select the analyser of your choice & my guide explains how to use it.

If you are using Wi-Fi Scanner, then please attach the zip file to this thread. As soon as I have downloaded it, I will remove the attachment from your post, to preserve your privacy.

With all other analysers, please follow my instructions below.

Collect the screenshots that I require and include them in your reply.

Please post the screenshots to me in a PM (to protect your privacy), which I have requested in my guide. No photos please as they can be difficult to read, because the text can get out of focus when zoomed in. Please ensure that the analyser window is maximised (if Windows) before taking the screenshots & upload them via the "Insert Photos" button (in a mobile browser it's the picture icon) on the post editor's toolbar with the Size parameter set to Large.