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emails to hotmail being blocked

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116 REPLIES
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GBy123
Wizz Kid

Having had several emails to hotmail addresses returned  - it looks as if hotmail addresses are now on the #tiscali/Talk Talk blocked list. This is highly inconvenient -will this be sorted soon.

Messasge I receive - 

Reason: The following message to @hotmail.co.uk was undeliverable.The reason for the problem:  550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, messages from [62.24.135.134] weren't sent. Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block list (AS3150). You can also refer your provider to http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors.

 

Comments please.

Gondola
Community Star

Hi @GBy123

 

MXToolbox lists 62.24.135.134 as being on Woody's SMTP Blacklist. Woody's SMTP Blacklist is a personal blacklist. A listing here means that the IP address has been caught by the spam trap listme@blacklist.woody.ch. One of the targets of this list is spammers who collect email addresses via email harvester software.

 

What this means is that a spammer has been using a TalkTalk email address to send out spam and that spam has been caught by the spam trap.

 

It's just an ongoing fight and why email users are finding their email accounts locked because suspicious activity has been detected.  So TalkTalk are being pro-active in trying to get rid of unauthorised use of compromised email accounts in order to get rid of spam blacklistings. 

 

Here's a test you can do courtesy of MXToolbox

 

  • Step 1: Send an email to ping@tools.mxtoolbox.com
  • Step 2: Once you have sent that message it will reply. Click the link: "View your full Deliverability Report"

You might find, as I just have, that a different IP address might be used by the TalkTalk mail server and it comes back clean.  In which case just retry sending email to your Microsoft email users.

 

 Gondola - I'm a PlusTV customer *
GBy123
Wizz Kid

Thanks for that - tried MX toolbox and got a report, but unfortunately it is all foreign to me.  There were some X's in left hand block - are these the blacklisted ones and then a load of stuff on the right.    Anyway, is it me that is being blocked, or the hotmail addresses I send to?   I can send myself an email no problem.  The mail that failed originally was sent to 9 people in a group, three of whom have hotmail addresses and were returned.

 

I am completely confused but just hope it will magically sort itself out overnight as sometimes happens.

Dave5359
Popular Poster

Having the same problemto multiple hotmail addresses.  Seems to have started today.  Get message  'Unfortunately, messages from [62.24.135.132] weren't sent. Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block list (AS3140). '

Gondola
Community Star

Hi @Dave5359

 

MX Toolbox indicates that 62.24.135.132 isn't on any of the usual blacklists. 

 Gondola - I'm a PlusTV customer *
Gondola
Community Star

Hi @GBy123

 

First thing you see on the report is the IP address currently being used for your emails.  What is it?

 Gondola - I'm a PlusTV customer *
mrf3049
First Timer

Hi,  Having sent a message to 90 people on three small mailing lists I have , after about 24h, received  notice that none of the hotmail or outlook addresses have been delivered  -  I have never experienced problems before.

 

Having tried again just for the rejected addresses using a gmail account  I'm hoping the messages will be received.

 

Can anyone explain who has caused the problem ?  Is it talktalk ?   Is it hotmail ?    Is my email address compromised ?  Are all the addresses which I'm trying to reach compromised ?   Who do I ask to sort things out or is it my fault and therefore up to me to resolve ?

 

With no IT knowledge I

 

 

Gondola
Community Star

Hi @mrf3049

 

What bounce back error message did you get?  Others have received messages indicating that the TalkTalk email sender is on a Microsoft blacklist. 

 

However, today, I've seen only one instance of blacklisting on a specialist spamcatcher blacklist. 

 

 Gondola - I'm a PlusTV customer *
gazzawazza
Conversation Starter

hi all

 

I'm getting this too:

 

****************************************************************************

 

      This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.     

 

Delivery to the following recipients was aborted after 1 second(s):

 

  * xxxxxxxxxx

 

Reason: The following message to xxxxxxx was undeliverable.The reason for the problem:  550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, messages from [62.24.135.133] weren't sent. Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block list (AS3150). You can also refer your provider to http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors.

 

Got this message on 10.54am on Fri 08 Sep 2017

 

****************************************************************************

 

xxxxxxx = a mailbox on a hotmail.co.uk domain

 

Subsequent emails to a few different hotmail.co.uk mailboxes all produced "Maximum Retry Queue Age Reached". Typically after 24-25 hours. Got these reports over the course of an hour between 10.30ish and 11.30ish (am) on saturday 9th Sep 2017

 

I've also had a spate of "Maximum Retry Queue Age Reached" approx 2 weeks ago on the jeffmoores.net domain (over days 28-30 August). It's possible that the jeffmoores.net issues were due to the relevant MX record changing (I did some digging at the time).

 

Haven't tried any of the affected mailboxes listed above since.

 

Very annoying.

 

Tested using ping@tools.mxtoolbox.com. Return message indicates tiscali SMTP server used was 62.24.135.132 (i.e. last octet is different to one specified as blacklisted - "62.24.135.133")

 

 

 

 

 

Regards,


Gary

gazzawazza
Conversation Starter

Another 2 bounce messages on hotmail.com mailboxes.

 

 

********************************************************************

 

      This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.     

 

 

Delivery to the following recipients was aborted after 1 second(s):

 

  * xxxxxxxxxx

 

Reason: The following message to xxxxxxxxxx was undeliverable.The reason for the problem:  550 SC-002 (SNT004-MC9F5) Unfortunately, messages from 62.24.135.132 weren't sent. Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block list. You can also refer your provider to http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors.

 

********************************************************************

 

Found a suggestion to try using http://ipremoval.sms.symantec.com/lookup/. Tested both IPs I've used recently for tiscali SMTP servers (62.24.135.132 and 62.24.135.133). Both apparently did NOT have a negative reputation.

 

"The IP address you submitted, 62.24.135.133, does not have a negative reputation and therefore cannot be submitted for investigation."

 

Clearly though, hotmail is still having an issue with tiscali SMTP servers.

 

Really hope this can be investigated and resolved. This has been going on for several days now.

 

 

Regards,

 

Gary

mrf3049
First Timer

Hi,  error messages exactly as given by Gary  except on friday  62.24.135.133 shown as originating IP address, on saturday last part was 132  and then trying the ping test mentioned in an earlier reply last part was 134.

 

Most of my messages received the 'time out' response.

 

Hope this makes sense  as I really have no idea about any of this !

mrf3049
First Timer

Have spoken with Talktalk  'Helpline'  -  as I understand it  Hotmail have blocked the Tiscali addresses they are therefore the ones who have to unblock them.  I was advised to ask my contacts to inform Hotmail that my address is being blocked and they wish it to be unblocked.  If this works only on an individual level then it does not address the more general problem that exists here.

 

In any case Many of my contacts would find all this too much of a challenge  to get involved with so I'm not really any further forward.

 

Perhaps I should set up a hotmail address but then, as things stand, I wouldn't be able to communicate with myself !

 

 

Gondola
Community Star

Hi @mrf3049

 

MXToolbox reports that 62.24.135.132 is clean and not on any blacklist.

MXToolbox reports that 62.24.135.133 is on Woodys Blacklist, as mentioned in my post above, and WPBL.  But as MXTools notes WPBL should not be used to block mail or deny SMTP connections.  So that comes back to Woodys Blacklist as being the issue.

MXToolbox reports that 62.24.135.134 is on Woodys Blacklist

Now Woodys do not accept requests for de-listing.  So nothing that TalkTalk can do other than continue to secure email accounts that have become compromised and used by spammers that then get caught by the spam traps set by Woodys.

Perhaps Microsoft shouldn't rely on Woodys Blacklist alone but use several blacklists in association to determine a sender's reputation? 

 

Anyone contacting Microsoft re this issue is obviously going to come up against resistance because Microsoft are just trying to protect recipients from spam.  But use the argument that reliance on using just one blacklist source alone isn't fair on genuine email users.

 

As not all TalkTalk email sender IP's are impacted by being on Woodys blacklist just keep trying and inevitably you'll get a sender IP address that is clean and does get through.

 

 Gondola - I'm a PlusTV customer *
gazzawazza
Conversation Starter

mrf3049 wrote:

Have spoken with Talktalk  'Helpline'  -  as I understand it  Hotmail have blocked the Tiscali addresses they are therefore the ones who have to unblock them.  I was advised to ask my contacts to inform Hotmail that my address is being blocked and they wish it to be unblocked.  If this works only on an individual level then it does not address the more general problem that exists here.

 

In any case Many of my contacts would find all this too much of a challenge  to get involved with so I'm not really any further forward.

 

Perhaps I should set up a hotmail address but then, as things stand, I wouldn't be able to communicate with myself !

 

 hi mrf3049 

 

While the helpline have technically been accurate, in that hotmail are blocking us, this is affecting multiple users sending to hotmail users. I believe the tiscali mail servers have been blocked (for whatever reasons).

 

This is without doubt a high/wide level network issue, which means the network and email team at talktalk HAS to communicate with hotmail, to rectify the problem.

 

This is not an individual user issue IMO.

 

Typically unhelpful Tech Support response - it's someone else's problem, when in fact, to fix the issue both parties have to get involved. This is not an issue where individual customers/clients have to take action.

 

Btw, this is not the first time this has happened.

https://community.talktalk.co.uk/t5/Email-Webmail/I-have-problems-sending-emails-to-HOTMAIL-addresse...

 

 

 

Regards,


Gary

Gondola
Community Star

Hi @gazzawazza

 

I'm sure that TalkTalk does take multiple steps to ensure the reputation of their email servers including but not limited to:

 

  • Contacting their opposite numbers in Microsoft
  • Continuing to identify possible spam on TalkTalk email senders
  • Configuring alternate IP addresses to use in place of temporarily blocked IP's
  • Contributing to user education on the importance of email security
  • Contributing to industry intelligence on countering spam

But users making Hotmail aware is better than keeping quiet about the effect that reliance on one minor blacklist is having on Hotmail customers in my opinion.

 Gondola - I'm a PlusTV customer *
gazzawazza
Conversation Starter
Gondola wrote:

Hi @mrf3049

 

MXToolbox reports that 62.24.135.132 is clean and not on any blacklist.

MXToolbox reports that 62.24.135.133 is on Woodys Blacklist, as mentioned in my post above, and WPBL.  But as MXTools notes WPBL should not be used to block mail or deny SMTP connections.  So that comes back to Woodys Blacklist as being the issue.

MXToolbox reports that 62.24.135.134 is on Woodys Blacklist

Now Woodys do not accept requests for de-listing.  So nothing that TalkTalk can do other than continue to secure email accounts that have become compromised and used by spammers that then get caught by the spam traps set by Woodys.

Perhaps Microsoft shouldn't rely on Woodys Blacklist alone but use several blacklists in association to determine a sender's reputation? 

 

Anyone contacting Microsoft re this issue is obviously going to come up against resistance because Microsoft are just trying to protect recipients from spam.  But use the argument that reliance on using just one blacklist source alone isn't fair on genuine email users.

 

As not all TalkTalk email sender IP's are impacted by being on Woodys blacklist just keep trying and inevitably you'll get a sender IP address that is clean and does get through.

 

Useful post. Very handy to know that you can check IPs on MXTOOLBOX.

 

I've done some checking and just under half tiscali's SMTP servers are currently on woody's blocklist and/or WPBL (EDIT: just worked through adjacent IPs to 62.24.135.133 - seems like there were 12 SMTP-OUT servers).

 

Presumably due to load-balancing, you can't use individually named mail servers (or alternatively I'm doing something else wrong).

 

 

 

I'm sure that TalkTalk does take multiple steps to ensure the reputation of their email servers including but not limited to:

 

  • Contacting their opposite numbers in Microsoft
  • Continuing to identify possible spam on TalkTalk email senders
  • Configuring alternate IP addresses to use in place of temporarily blocked IP's
  • Contributing to user education on the importance of email security
  • Contributing to industry intelligence on countering spam

But users making Hotmail aware is better than keeping quiet about the effect that reliance on one minor blacklist is having on Hotmail customers in my opinion.

Well the alternative IP addresses don't seem to be in place or employed yet, since people are still having send issues UPDATE: I had literally tested about 30 mins ago and a hotmail message was sent through 62.24.135.133 (i.e. it bounced). HOWEVER, during an investigation of whether I can edit my DNS into routing to 62.24.135.132 (a clean server), I've discovered an alternative IP has been deployed. Thank you talktalk.

 

EDIT1: 23:00 (on sunday 10th Sep) just tested again and despite smtp.lineone.net being configured to 62.24.139.43 (a clean IP address), messages are still being routed out from blocked SMTP servers (62.24.135.133). No work-round/alternative IP address appears to have been deployed.

 

NOTE: for those who have the tech knowledge to do this, trying flushing your local dns cache. This may resolve your send issues.

 

I'd agree that there's spam abuse due to compromised accounts/passwords but then there's also compromised computers. I always recommend a full anti-virus sweep before a password change, so that any loggers and/or trojans can be hopefully picked up before re-securing your account and/or machine. So, ok, I buy into user education (but this is a long term thing).

 

However, for some, using IT is a bewildering experience at the best of times, so helping people to take preventative measures, which don't have significant performance effects (things cease to work because of anti-virus intervention, just as a crude example), isn't easy. I certainly know people who are very resistent to changing passwords, just because they find it hard to keep track of them. Password best practice encourages different passwords for every account, which just isn't workable in the real world.

I wouldn't know if Woody's is a minor spamlist or not. We don't know that hotmail chose to block exclusively on the basis of the mail servers being listed there. I'd have thought it's as least as likely hotmail has blocked, based on seeming spam origin (or perhaps a combination of the listing and evidence eminating from those IPs). I found a reference on the woody website suggesting that database entries drop off after 14 days. I suspect that gives time for organisations to take action on spam abuse. I suspect resolution time will also depend on what compliance hotmail/microsoft expects of talktalk.

 

It would help if we can have some definite information from talktalk's email or network team on the matter i.e. what has happened, what steps are being taken to resolve the matter and a likely date for normal operations to resume. There's nothing on the talktalk services status page to indicate any email issues. Perhaps you or an OCE can facilitate this?

 

Finally, making users feel it's their responsiblity to notify hotmail directly or indirectly will simply make users feel it's their fault.

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Gary

paul1896
Chatterbox

This is happening to me too. All hotmail and outlook addresses are coming back with messages  The reason for the problem:  550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, messages from [62.24.135.132] weren't sent. Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block list (AS3140). and  The reason for the problem:  550 SC-002 (COL004-MC1F36) Unfortunately, messages from 62.24.135.132 weren't sent. Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block list.

gazzawazza
Conversation Starter

paul1896 wrote:

This is happening to me too. All hotmail and outlook addresses are coming back with messages  The reason for the problem:  550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, messages from [62.24.135.132] weren't sent. Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block list (AS3140). and  The reason for the problem:  550 SC-002 (COL004-MC1F36) Unfortunately, messages from 62.24.135.132 weren't sent. Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block list.


Thanks very much Paul. That's useful.

 

It also shows that Microsoft are not blocking solely on the basis of Woody's spamlist, since MXTOOLBOX reports 62.24.135.132 as not appearing on any spamlists (FYI @Gondola)

 

@paul1896

In summary, hotmail/microsoft appear to be blocking multiple talktalk email servers. This is because of presumably spam being detected as coming from them.

This has been crudely confirmed by talktalk customer support. However, we have had nothing specific from the talktalk technical support teams who must be involved with the problem. Communication about this problem has been, bluntly, very poor by talktalk.

 

@Gondola

Could you possibly get an update for us and/or get an OCE to chase and update (I don't know how much influence you have, as a community star)?

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Gary

Gondola
Community Star

...already flagged up for the TalkTalk Community Support team. 

 

Just sent an email to one of my Microsoft accounts and like others who have retried and been successful my email got through fine first time.

 

The TalkTalk sending IP was 62.24.135.69 and amusingly I checked MXTools after receiving the email ok and found this IP on the SORBS Spam blacklist which I would have expected Microsoft to have taken more notice of!  But then again it was only one blacklist and I'd certainly prefer any email service not to block on the basis of just one blacklist and to use other screening criteria as well.

 

 Gondola - I'm a PlusTV customer *
gazzawazza
Conversation Starter

Gondola wrote:

...already flagged up for the TalkTalk Community Support team. 


 thanks mate

 

 


Just sent an email to one of my Microsoft accounts and like others who have retried and been successful my email got through fine first time.

 

 

The TalkTalk sending IP was 62.24.135.69 and amusingly I checked MXTools after receiving the email ok and found this IP on the SORBS Spam blacklist which I would have expected Microsoft to have taken more notice of!  But then again it was only one blacklist and I'd certainly prefer any email service not to block on the basis of just one blacklist and to use other screening criteria as well.

 


@Gondola

 As per my last post (one of many, I agree), 62.24.135.132 (smtp-out-4.tiscali.co.uk) ISN'T on a spamlist but is blocked (as per Paul1896's post: https://community.talktalk.co.uk/t5/Email-Webmail/emails-to-hotmail-being-blocked/m-p/2098572#M84721), which would indicate blocking is not solely based on spamlist inclusion.

 

 

Cheers,

 

Gaz