Could I question the sync speed you are reporting (25.7 Mbps), I did ask @OCE_Chris earlier in the thread about similar results but he didn't really answer.
You say my sync is currently 25.7 Mbps. I have just run three seperate speedest.
1. Ookla as provided by Microsoft shop - downstream 25.5 Mbps. This is 99% of your reported sync speed.
2. Thinkbroadband - 25.3 Mbps - 98% of your reported sync speed.
3. TalkTalk test via "My Broadband" (so Ookla again) - 25.4 Mbps - 99% of your reported sync speed.
So, 25.5, 25.3 and 25.4 - these seem to be very comparible results from different sources.
These speed tests were performed on a wifi connected Windows 10 PC - I would suggest that these are practically impossible figures based on your quoted sync speed, the lose between a router and any connected device is more than 1 or 2 percent. TalkTalk usually quote double digit "loses", 1 or 2 percent is deserving of examination.
My router is showing a line speed of 27.2 Mbps - this is consistant with the reported speedtests, and the ratio (low 90%'s) is very similar to the results I have had for the last 3 or 4 years as a fibre customer.
Is there a problem at your side causing low sync speeds to be reported ? Could this possible misreporting be a cause of DLM's lack of positive on intervention on my line.
Alternatively could you suggest a reason for these quite extrodinary results ?
But as to the question in my previous post - do your line stats show any outages, resets or issues, more specifically over the last three days ?
I've checked the sync speed directly on the Openreach website and it's showing 25.8Mbps. I agree that your wireless speed test results are high for a sync speed of 25.8Mbps, they are also high for a sync speed of 27.2Mbps.
I don't know why there is a slight difference between the sync speed reported by the router and the sync speed reported directly on the Openreach website or why the speed test results are so high but this isn't really something that we can report as a fault.
My speedtest results are within acceptable bounds for a fibre sync speed of over 27 Mbps.
A difference of over 10% in your reported "BTOR" sync speed and the routers' reported sync speed is significant. Could it be a strange little bug in the new V2.00t firmware on the HG633 (I never had any issues before moving to this firmware level). It is the firmware that negotiates the line speed with BTOR's fibre systems, it is the firmware that reports what I can see - TalkTalk's firmware.
Chris, I'm guessing that your background is customer services oriented rather than technical. Most techies would at least be curious (rather than dismissive) about this issue. But another guess - TalkTalk don't pay you to be curious.
If we (the end users) can't believe the stats we are seeing from the router what are we suppossed to believe ? When an OCE asks for line stats for diagnostic purposes do they believe the numbers we report back or do they assume the router reported stats are wrong and should be ignored (as you appear to be dismissing the stats I am reporting) ?
Have you even considered asking TT's technical team for an opinion or to see if they have seen this before ? Not just does the line look OK, but the specifics of this particular problem. Inconsistances can be symptomatic of actual or potential problems. It doesn't need BTOR at this stage.
Something is not quite right, can you at least admit that ?
Can I ask the question that I have already asked @OCE_Ady twice with no specific reply. From the stats you have access to can you see if there have been any issues, outages, resets, DLM interaction etc.. over the last 3 days ?
"A difference of over 10% in your reported "BTOR" sync speed and the routers' reported sync speed is significant."
I make it more like 5% but I could be wrong, maths isn't my strong point 🙂
"Chris, I'm guessing that your background is customer services oriented rather than technical."
"Can I ask the question that I have already asked @OCE_Ady twice with no specific reply. From the stats you have access to can you see if there have been any issues, outages, resets, DLM interaction etc.. over the last 3 days ?"
The last profile change was on the 14th and there were 12 retrains on the 14th to, none since.
I'll ask our product team about the difference in reported sync speed, see if they can cast any light on it
The no retrains since the 14th is quite interesting, I made a change to one of the routers parameters on the 14th, but still early days.
I will await the technical teams response with anticipation.
Seems like maths may not be my strongest suit either, but even by your lower suggested value I believe we are still within the realms of statistical significance. But if you consider that I was getting around 32 Mbps a few days ago, and 40 Mbps a few months ago it is still a significant performce drop.
Any progress on the promised refund ?
The router isn't showing as returned yet, when it is we'll process the refund, can you bump the thread on Friday and we'll check again
Our product team have confirmed that they don't know why there is a difference between the sync speed reported by the router and the Openreach website. they don't really seem to think that it's significant
The Royal Mail, more known for outdated business practises and underwhelming IT systems, can take my item on a Friday and over a weekend (non-business days) can have it physically at your address by first thing Monday morning, but here we are 2 days later and TalkTalk haven't manged to enter it onto your system.
The production team don't think a discrepancy between 2 major reporting metrics which should be identical is "not significant".
TalkTalk never fail to amaze.
Working on a possible theory that the misreported stats and my line crashes and retrains may be associated (with V2.00t firware changes) .........
To try and assist the investigation - I asked yesterday if there had been any issues indicated on my line in the previous three days, you said not. My router stats today are not indicating any further issues (which I guess you can confirm), so my line appears to have run clean now for around 4 days.
4 days ago I disabled TR069.
Might be just a coincidence.
I think "probably" may be a bit of a stretch.
My router was crashing and resetting (according to the router logs) at more or less exactly the same time as my router was being remotely accesssed. I stop the TR069 access and there hasn't been any incidents since. A possible coincidence, but quite a long way from a probable coincidence.
A fact that may be worth passing on to whoever is doing the investigation rather than just "bearing in mind". Effects normally have a cause and disabling TR069 may just be the cause of the change in the reported error rates on my router/line.
It could all be indicative of a potential firmware issue.
A few minutes short of 9 days since I disabled TR069 and things from my side are still looking stable, no untowards entries in the router logs.
Could you confirm how my line is looking from the stats you have available ?
Ok thanks. That confirms the information I am seeing here from the router stats and logs. Except my router still says that I am in sync at 27257 Kbps (confirmed as a more probable value by multiple speed tests).
I do not appear to have had any further degredation issues since I disabled TR069. It is possible that my disabling TR069 has helped to stabilise my line by stopping that intrusion and that could indicate a potential bug in V2.00t firmware. I also notice there are others on the forums now reporting this pattern of slowly degrading performace with HG633 and V2.00t firmware.
It would be relatively easy to recreate my original performance conditions so that I could then enable TR069 and monitor the effect of that change. Would TT be interesting in performing this testing ?
Obviously I don't know if your teams are still looking at this, but I have just run another series of performance tests, the downstream results were :-
Thinkbroadband - 25.3 Mbps
TalkTalk - 25.4 Mbps
uSwitch - 24.8 Mbps
Ookla - 25.4 Mbps
Which - 25.4 Mbps
BBUK - 25.3 Mbps
These are a very consistant set of numbers from a variety of sources. But I would again suggest that these numbers are not practical if my (as reported by yourselves) sync speed is 25.8 Mbps. Any lose to any device would be expected to be significantly greater than that, particularly over wifi.
All my tests were done on a wifi connected pc (approx. 12 feet from the router and up a flight of stairs). I do have a "clean" wifi environment in my property, but even so throughput loses are to be expected.
Just my opinion, but something doesn't add up.
My HG633 with V2.00t firmware was continually resetting, in an earlier post @OCE_Chris listed resets and multiple retrains. When I checked around 15 or 16 days ago the resets coincided with TR069 remote access to my router. Over time my line speed dropped from high 30's to mid 20's, the pattern of those sync reduction was compatible with DLM trying to stabilise my line because of perceived issues. He stated that these errors had continued for some time, (predating my wifi hub trials, but obviously not relevant to those trials). All the problems were after my upgrade to V2.00t firmware.
I disabled TR069 15 days ago and all the resets etc. stopped immediately. For 15 days absolutely no issues, except for the low sync speed, which looking at my router stats seemed to indicate that my line had been banded (lower rate fixed profile) because of the excessive retries and errors etc.. I was getting my normal max. downstream, but a very high SNR and consequently a poor line (sync) speed.
Until the early hours of this morning ......................
After 15 days (which I believe is a "full" DLM cycle period) my performance was changed for the better.
After 15 days with no crashes and no issues DLM has now increased my downstream sync speed to 33978, which I think is the next upwards banding level. My downstream SNR has reduced to closer to the "standard" 6dB.
So TR069 enabled, my sync consistantly decreases and multiple issues are reported, disable TR069 my sync speed stabilises and now appears to start to improve.
I am still suspicious of the TR069 interaction. The limited testing I have been able to do would appear to indicate a connection between my performance and TR069 activity, at a correlation level potentially beyond simple coincidence, but further testing would seem to be appropriate.
As a matter of interest, what sync speed are you now seeing for my line now that it has changed.
EDIT - I've just added a speedtest to "My Account" - 31 Mbps using a wireless link.