30-06-2018 10:09 AM - edited 30-06-2018 12:31 PM
My wifi hub has now been installed and running for a few days with DLM making no changes, so some sort of interesting stats from the gui that an OCE may want to feed back to the development team.
Downstream noise margin is being reported as 0.00 dB.
Upstream attenuation is being reported as 0.00 dB.
Downstream attenuation is being reported as 25.90 (usually been in the 19-21 range with previous TalkTalk super routers).
Upstream max rate exactly 6000 Kbps, actual upstream rate exactly 6000 Kbps, upstream noise margin exactly 6.0 dB. Now these numbers could be correct, but they do look unusually rounded. With HG633 and HG635 my max. upstream was just short of 8 Mbps, so lost performance.
But the thing that concerns me is the performance of this "best ever" modem-router.
I have listed the upstream performanc loss already.
With an HG635 my max. downstream was around 49 Mbps to 50 Mbps. With an actual line rate of 40 Mbps (on the 40/10 package).
With an HG633 my max rate dropped to around 43 Mbps, with an actual of around 38 Mbps.
With this new wifi hub my max. rate has dropped to 35 Mbps with an actuall of 32 Mbps. This unexpectedly large drop in downstream performance could be linked to the unexpected rise in the downstream attenuation.
But having spoken to someone in the faults team they are happy with this performance level as it is still within my predicted range (but massively less than I used to get). It would appear that everytime TalkTalk introduce a "new, improved" router that my performance levels go south.
But the wifi is better, although I never had any wifi issues, and this new router didn't resolve the issues I was having with the HG633 with V2.00t firmware.
on 06-07-2018 02:28 PM
"The max. downstream as being reported by the wifi hub appears to be consistant with the reported attenuation."
That may well be the case as the estimated max downstream may be estimated based on the attenuation reported by the router, but if the attenuation is being reported incorrectly this would mean that the estimated max downstream is being reported incorrectly and wouldn't restrict the speed that you could actually achieve. Anyway I've asked our product team to take a look at this
06-07-2018 02:49 PM - edited 06-07-2018 02:53 PM
You say my line has been banded to around 32 Mbps.
Is this a normal "soft banding" that DLM should adjust over time based on line statistics and performance or a "hard banding" based on very poor stability that is fixed and requires BTOR intervention to remove ?
on 06-07-2018 03:02 PM
Sorry, never heard of soft and hard banding, the band cap is set based on connections drops and/or the number of errors, measured again predefined limits as per the algorithm. If the connection remains stable with a low error count then DLM should move you to a faster profile (higher band cap), that's why we ask you to leave new equipment connected for a few days, to give DLM chance to monitor the line make any adjustements.
on 06-07-2018 09:04 PM
Apologies for my post but I have been following your topic with interest.
For comparison my TalkTalk 3782 Router reported familiar (very close to HG633) line stats as below...
But the new TalkTalk Hub reports the following...
Note the 0db noise margin on the download just like yours.
06-07-2018 10:11 PM - edited 06-07-2018 10:12 PM
Looks like you also have some dubious attenuation and SNR gui stats there from your wifi hub, which again do appear to be reflected in the performance oriented stats. Because your 40/10 package appears to have lots of headroom I'm guessing you aren't experiencing any actual impact.
But I will continue to bang my head on the wall that is TalkTalk.
on 09-07-2018 09:48 AM
So after 8 or 9 days of continuous use up to last Friday, a quick router swap (Fast5364 for Fast5364) then running all weekend, here are the stats. from 08:00 this morning :-
It seems that DLM may have attempted some sort of reset around 04:30 this morning, but it has made no significant difference to any stat. - so very much a spot the difference competition from all my previous wifi hub stats.
So after around 40 minutes down, I have now swapped back to my "old" HG633 running V2.00t firmware :-
Things to particularly notice :-
Down stream attenuation now back to my "normal range" - 20.9 dB.
Max. downstream has now risen to 41 Mbps - around 6 Mbps more than the wifi hub was reporting.
Downstream SNR now 7.2 dB - as opposses to the 0.00 reported by the FAST5364.
The upstream max. rate (8.5 Mbps) and noise margin (10.7 dB) have also significantly increased.
I will now leave this configuration running for a few days and see if DLM does anything positive.
on 09-07-2018 11:11 AM
There was a profile change in the early hours of the Saturday morning, but it only made slight adjustment. Line test is showing your current sync speed is 30.7Mbps so little bit down with the HG633 compared to Wi-Fi hub
on 09-07-2018 11:44 AM
A little surprised by your statement that I am now in sync at 30.7 Mbps.
My router stats are showing 32.2 Mbps (only 150 Kbps different) and two speedtests done via a wifi attached pc are indicating 30.2 Mbps (TT's own tester) and 29.5 Mbps (ThinkBroadband).
Given the usual loss between router and any device (particularly wifi attached) the numbers I am seeing are more consistant with the router's reported 32 Mbps download.
30.2 Mbps at a wireless device on a 30.7 download figure would be very surprising.
Or is this yet more TT inconsistant stats. ?
on 09-07-2018 02:00 PM
on 09-07-2018 03:12 PM
"30.2 Mbps at a wireless device on a 30.7 download figure would be very surprising.
Or is this yet more TT inconsistant stats. ?"
I agree (30.2 over wi-fi with a 32.4Mbps sync speed is also very high) - the sync speed is from Openreach stats not ours and it's still showing at 30.7Mbps
(thanks for returning the router)
on 10-07-2018 10:03 AM
It looks like DLM did not make any changes last night and this morning's stats. and speed tests are consistant with those reported yesterday. So potentially I may be right back to where I was a month and a half ago with degraded performance and a stuck profile following my initial move to V2.00t firmware on an HG633, but early days yet for DLM to react.
The one thing that is clear from the last few weeks of testing is that my HG633 and HG635 both have the capability to outperform the FAST5364. So any claims that the new wifi hub is one of your best yet appears to be misleading. Apart from the lack of performance I haven't even seen any improvements in wifi signal quality (which was always quite good in my property as evidenced by the speed tester results that I shared yesterday).
The wifi hub was arranged for me via the CEO's office to allow me to test if the new router correctly recognised the availability of vectoring (or not) on my line. I agreed a payment of £30 based on the theory that if it worked great, but if it didn't at least I would still have the "latest and greatest" router. Vectoring was not recognised, and my performance demonstrated a fairly significant lose of capability.
The FAST5364 did not resolve the vectoring issue, it did not improve my wifi performance and it degraded my broadband by an unacceptable margin - I would class that as a fairly epic fail.
I would like to return this wifi hub for a refund, as offered by OCE_Ady last week (and previously accepted).
If you (or @Debbie-TalkTalk) can confirm the refund and forward a returns bag I will despatch the router to you as soon as practical (and continue to use my HG633).
on 10-07-2018 11:21 AM
I'm happy to honour OCE_Ady's offer, I've ordered a returns bag it should be with you whithin a couple of days. if you could bump the thread three or four days after you return the router we'll check that it's back.
on 10-07-2018 01:03 PM
on 16-07-2018 01:55 PM
Hi iefbr14, the router return has yet been processed and it's not showing on your account yet. I'd expect it to take a day or so to come through. Please post back to remind me to chase this for you tomorrow.
17-07-2018 09:00 AM - edited 17-07-2018 09:03 AM
p.s. How are my connection stats looking - look ok here, but no signs of DLM making any attempt to recover my previous performance levels (so back at square 1 again ?).
on 17-07-2018 11:14 AM
The line stats look the same as they did when you had 30mbps synch speed, but it's currently 25.7mbps. The refund isn't showing on the system yet. If the warehouse team are busy there may be a slight delay getting that on there. I'll see if I can chase it up for you.