07404 is actually not a UK mobile network number the ranges for them are 074 - 079

[hecatae]

074 040 Mobile Lycamobile UK Mobile WiFi FW7 WiFi Services Lycamobile UK

the interesting bit is the FW7 allocation for charging.
as if you look here: sales.talktalk.co.uk/pricing/calls/uk-non-geographic
it's classed as a wifi service, just like 07405, 07406, 07417, 07424, 07438, 07440, 07466
it's within the 167 page number list here: m1.ttxm.co.uk/sites/broadband.talktalk.co.uk/pricing/pdf/TT_NGN_prefixes_010911.pdf

These numbers are indeed routed differently. If you call them your call is actually dialling into a server which is linked with other worldwide servers owned by the network you are calling. Thus Lycamobile and truphone can offer cheap rates in selected countries they are based in. So in uk with its server on o2. You actually physically roam on them. a landline call is sent through their servers and actually looks like is routed via some sort of voip so will explain why it shows unavailable on my caller display also why talktalk rates it as a wi fi number that the call routes to a server rather than mobile company

quick look up for numbers is here www.telecom-tariffs.co.uk/codelook.htm?xid=1013951&band=FW7

I suspect they've just got an 074 number allocation from Ofcom as a VoIP provider, setup an SS7 to SIP gateway (they may not even need this with ENUM), shoved the traffic through an Asterisk box to route outbound via whatever penny pinching company is cheapest for the current hour, then routed the mobile part to their roaming partners via the HLR.

will update this later, this is fascinating

[iamisaid]

This topic is similar to - www.talktalkmembers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68262

[hecatae]

it is, but it's not a billing query regarding my talktalk service.

are FW call charge number ranges typically voip numbers?

[iamisaid]

hecatae

I know your is not a billing query, I added it as a further reference as it contains OCE input.

Neil

[hecatae]

ok, more information:
www.aql.com/sms/network_lookup.php < this checks any number against OFCOM's database
throw in a 07404xxxxxx number and it states:

Ofcom Data
Network Lycamobile UK Limted
Use Mobile services
Change date 08-2009

so Ofcom class it as Mobile services, not Wifi services.
So Lyca Mobile, is a mobile sim card that only makes and receives calls routed over voip as it's classed as a voip number, it has no agreement to be a MVNO in the actual sense as it is roaming permanently, so if a Lyca Mobile number calls another Lyca Mobile sim they get charged as the numbers are never on-net.
This is probably worse than calling a satellite mobile number.

[SocialTeamEmma]

Hi hecatae,

Its a bit harsh to say its "buried" - the list is in numerical order and can be searched quickly using ctrl + F.

Cheers
Em x

[hecatae]

Okay Em, point taken

[nicktecky]

According to TT it's a Personal Services number.
As to what forum this should be on, I'm baffled.

Quote:
...................
EDIT ***********************************

The billing team have confirmed that 07404 numbers are not a standard mobile service:

"The number 07404 is classed as a Personal Numbering Services, which unfortunately is not classed as mobile and will not be included in the bundle."

For this reason the calls can not be inclided in the mobile boost. This is detailed in the pricing pages of the TalkTalk website. As the number is not classed as a mobile service number it can not be included in your boost.
...............
Unquote

As a customer, I have signed up for 100 inclusive Mobile Minutes. I don't expect to have to examine an Ofcom newsletter every time I make a call to find out if it's included!
Still, I'll not bother Ofcom about this, their website doesn't even mention Personal Numbering, and I'll be sure only to call friends, so no problem for me!
:rolleyes:

[FrankMT]

All very interesting.

The point I was trying to make on my (now locked) thread was that it wouldn't hurt for TT to put a link on the "100 Mobile Minute Boost" information page to the list of included networks.

OCE Emma wrote there:

it is possible to list every exception in the small print

I presume she meant "it is not possible to list every exception", but it would certainly be possible to provid a link to the "Pricing" page that already lists the included networks.

[nicktecky]

Em is absolutely right, it is unreasonable to expect TT to list every exception and expect the customer to then act on it.

However, it is not unreasonable for TT to give the customer the right to bar access to what are in effect premium rate numbers. To have an opt in to bar certain prefixes already exists, and it would need only one person from TT to maintain a list weekly, acting on Ofcom listings.

BTW: the topic title illustrates the problem caused by Ofcom's stupidity. 07404 IS IN the range 074-079. And it does apply to SIM cards in mobiles owned by people living in the UK. It just isn't a UK Mobile number.

SO, that's cleared that up then!
:rolleyes:

[nicktecky]

And how did we end up in this forum, anyway?

[hecatae]

we ended up in this forum, as I was interested to find out how a voip number can be assigned to a sim card and be permanaently roaming in the uk

[nicktecky]

Sorry I was referring to FrankMT.
We were bounced after complaining about these numbers.
AFAIK:
They are Personal Numbering Service numbers, so they use normal mobile networks (O2 and Orange), although they use roaming conditions.
Therefore the charging is different if you dial into them.
Not sure where VOIP comes into it.
Unless Lycatel have set up their own Skype-type service to do the international onpass.