Major delays to tiscali email. Same for everyone or just me?

[Flumoxd]

I'm very concerned about delays to received emails on one specific tiscali.co.uk address. As seen from the headers of the delayed messages, the delays can range from just a few hours to several days. Am I alone in this?

As to the details. I'm loath to post message headers at this time, but it's clear that the delay is in the first jump from the sender's servers to the incoming servers for talktalk. 

How do I get my concerns addressed outside of a public forum by sharing the message headers, which I presume are somewhat private.

Thanks for reading 😀

[amahle-TT]

Please do let us know how it goes after switching to webmail as we did mention that in order for us to diagnose the issue and find the solution, we will need you to use webmail, thanks.

[Flumoxd]

Thanks for the suggestion. As far as the delayed messages from this financial service are concerned, I've already switched my registered email address to another provider. If it transpires that mails from this new provider are delayed, then I'll consider your webmail experiment.

I fully appreciate that in order to explain the delays you (TT) need to remove all variables including any that might be introduced by email clients, so I support your remarks. 

Nevertheless, please review the message in post #6 from @Billx . There he shows an properly edited, much simplified extract from the stuff I posted. I can't see how that sent/received time/date info could vary based on my use of TT webmail or of an email client on my PC.

[nambuso-TT]

In order for us to diagnose the issue, we will need you to use webmail given that the same error is occurring when using webmail. There could be various reasons why there is a delay when you receive emails, It could be the issue with the server, the person that is sending you an email or the fact that you are using a third party emails. Thanks

[Flumoxd]

Hi and thanks for this. 

I'm taking the sent/received information from the email headers. The general information about the delays is based on what I've seen, and is apparently independent of the email client. I was experiencing the same delays from time to time when I was using MS Outlook. (As in the Office suite not the "freebie"; I switched to the free Thunderbird when I bought a new PC).

To be frank, it simply is not clear to me where the delays are being created. The financial service's date and time is what was expected, and as soon as the message was received by you, it was sent to me in the blink of an eye. It's that mysterious (to me) gap between them sending it and you receiving it that has me Flumoxd.

Is what you're saying is these email clients may be misreporting the information or create different information? All I know is that in some cases emails that should have been received immediately* when I used a specific financial service did not arrive in my inbox for hours or days later. (* within seconds/minutes)

[nambuso-TT]

Hi there @Flumoxd. It could be what @Gliwmaeden2 has stated above however since you are using Thunderbird we will not be able to diagnose the issue as thunderbird is a third party email. Alternatively you can switch to webmail then we can try to diagnose the issue. Thanks

[Flumoxd]

All the mails that are problematic are "push" mails from an American financial provider. They are triggered automatically when I use their services to buy stuff. I use K9 mail and this does not offer that "include me as a recipient" feature. I generally use K9 to read mail on my phone, but all then mails are stored locally (or deleted) using Thunderbird on my laptop.

[Flumoxd]

So I did just that. Now must rush off to SpecSavers...

When I clicked on reply, Thunderbird reported it was not a valid email address. I went back to the original headers that I had shared and saw that the line in post #8

Reply-To: REDACTED <REDACTED@tiscal...>

is exactly that. The email address is not resolved to tiscali.co.uk, for example,  but truncated to tiscali three dots (tiscali...). So, although my email address seems to be in a reply to field, it's not valid.

[Gliwmaeden2]

It may be that at some stage you've clicked on "include me as a recipient" which appears (mine is a Samsung app) above the From address, @Flumoxd ?

 It would certainly make sense to actually use that for keeping duplicates of anything important- although they are obviously also to be found in the "sent" box.

In sent, in this app, the emails sent automatically disappear from view after a week or two [so not like in Gmail, for example] but are retrievable if searched for.

Automatically being sent a copy of what you have sent means that you will have it current in your INBOX with every reply for reference and could be useful for storing records when it comes to correspondence about contracts etc.

I've never clicked on it myself, but it's there for a reason and could be useful. It's probably just since the spring that I have started noticing the option too, so it's maybe a new "thing" with some email clients?

Easy to select it by mistake too as our screens are so touch sensitive...

Just some thoughts.😊

[Billx]

Hi, @Flumoxd 

I suppose, if you tried to reply to the sender (using the reply button) , the email program will try to send a reply email to yourself.

[Flumoxd]

Absolutely agree. The reply to my address field should not be there.

Just checked my stored messages from this sender. It appears they have been sending messages to me that also include my address in a "reply to" field since mid-March this year. Messages sent to me before this date only have my address in the "to" field. None of the other informational messages from this same sender have this double addressing.

[Billx]

Hi, @Flumoxd 

Yes I use Thunderbird. And if there is a Reply-To email address, when one receives an email, it will always display it, at the top, with other details From: To: Reply-To: Subject, and Date on the far right.

But I have never seen my OWN Name and email address in Reply-To: , only in To:

The Reply-To: is only used by the sender, I.E. associated with the one in From:

The Reply-To is only used by the sender, if the sender wants to receive any replies from the recipient, in an secondary email address to the From: email address. Usually Reply-To is not used. So any replies are sent to the From: email address.

So, in your email you received, in the Reply-To, your email address shouldn't be there.

[Flumoxd]

@Billx 

I've just noticed that the To and Reply To fields are showing up in the normal display of email in Thunderbird and both of these fields point to my tiscali.co.uk address. As above this is only visible in mails concerning transactions.

[Flumoxd]

Hi

Yes, it's exactly that:

From: SENDER'S_NAME @ REDACTED SENDER'S_EMAIL
To: REDACTED (My name then My email address)
Reply-To: REDACTED (My name then My email address)
Subject: ..whatever..

I get mails that fall into three categories from this sender. One is for financial transactions, one for messages relating to my account, and finally one that says I've logged in from a new device. It's only the ones that are the financial transactions that carry this reply to quandry. None of the others have the Reply-To: line at all.

If the problem continues, I'll experiment changing my registered mail to a non-tiscali address.

Of the problem goes away, they will have taken notice of my complaint from some weeks ago.

Anyway, thanks for your continued interest.

[Billx]

Hi, @Flumoxd 

Just a minor thing.

In EMAIL 1 (which was the same as EMAIL 3), it had a 'Reply-To:' line:

Reply-To: REDACTED <REDACTED@tiscal...>

The email address there would be an alternative address, for you to reply to <service@REDACTED SENDER.co.uk>,

not for them to reply to you.

So, was <REDACTED@tiscal...> their alternative email address?

I couldn't understand that.

Thanks

[Flumoxd]

@Billx Many thanks for your analysis; and apologies for the amateur duplication mistake.

Just FYI, the missing file was for a UK energy supplier where a 3hours 33min delay meant I was unable to take advantage of a flash pricing offer. But hey ho.

Posting my stuff here was me trying to clutch at straws because, as you note, once TT servers had their hands on the messages, they sent them through quickly.

I'll get back in contact with the senders and see if there's anything that can be done.

Again, thanks.

[Billx · Accepted solution]

Hi, @Flumoxd 

I've tidied it up, a bit for you.

2 of the 3 emails you posted, are exactly the same.

Yes, the other 2 emails, have a big delay from when they were originally sent, and when they were received by REDACTED SENDER.com in Yankeeland.

There was no need to keep that company in Yankeeland private.

The 2 emails went first from service@REDACTED SENDER.co.uk to mx4.slc.REDACTED SENDER.com 

I don't think there's any way TalkTalk could explain this.

EMAIL 1 received by @Flumoxd From: <service@REDACTED SENDER.co.uk>
Received: from mx4.slc.REDACTED SENDER.com ([])
by oxseu3nmtai03p.internal.vadesecure.com with ngmta
id 493c8ad0-186b62aaa12e0d44; Sat, 04 Oct 2025 20:09:24 +0000

Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2025 04:08:09 -0700
From: <service@REDACTED SENDER.co.uk>
To: REDACTED <REDACTED@tiscali.co.uk>
Reply-To: REDACTED <REDACTED@tiscal...>
Subject: REDACTED SUBJECT

Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2025 04:08:09 -0700 --> Sat, 04 Oct 2025 20:09:24 +0000 --> difference = 4 days 9 hours
-
EMAIL 2 received by @Flumoxd From: <service@REDACTED SENDER.co.uk>
Received: from mx5.slc.REDACTED SENDER.com ([])
by oxseu3nmtai03p.internal.vadesecure.com with ngmta
id f2e70984-186bf00cc5ed9493; Mon, 06 Oct 2025 15:20:17 +0000

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2025 03:20:14 -0700
From: <service@REDACTED SENDER.co.uk>
To: REDACTED <REDACTED@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: You have messages from REDACTED SENDER

Mon, 06 Oct 2025 03:20:14 -0700 --> Mon, 06 Oct 2025 03:20:14 -0700 --> difference = 10 hours

-
EMAIL 3 received by @Flumoxd From: <service@REDACTED SENDER.co.uk>
Received: from mx4.slc.REDACTED SENDER.com ([])
by oxseu3nmtai03p.internal.vadesecure.com with ngmta
id 493c8ad0-186b62aaa12e0d44; Sat, 04 Oct 2025 20:09:24 +0000

Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2025 04:08:09 -0700
From: <service@REDACTED SENDER.co.uk>
To: REDACTED <REDACTED@tiscali.co.uk>
Reply-To: REDACTED <REDACTED@tiscal...>
Subject: REDACTED SUBJECT

Tue, 30 Sep 2025 04:08:09 -0700 --> Sat, 04 Oct 2025 20:09:24 +0000 --> difference = 4 days 9 hours

-
Note: EMAIL 1 is the same as EMAIL 3

[Flumoxd]

Attached are three examples of headers from emails that have been delayed. I've replaced my address with the word "REDACTED", and the names of the senders with the word "REDACTED SENDER".

There's one UK sender, where this mail was delayed by ~4 hours. There are two mails from the USA. One was delayed by hours in once case and delayed by days in another case. Thinking specifically about the USA sender, their mails would normally get to me (ie, be on TT servers for me to download) within a few seconds. Time-sensitive mails being delayed is of most concern.

I have a feeling this is outside of my hands, but am willing to stand corrected.

Addendum. Ideally, I would have uploaded the example headers as plain .txt files, but they've been rejected with the message e.g. "The attachment's email delays3 =days= names redacted.txt content type (text/plain) does not match its file extension and has been removed." I changed the coding but in the end have printed them as pdf and hope this is acceptable.

[Billx]

Hi, @Flumoxd 

If you are using Thunderbird, the same method would work.

I use Thunderbird as well.

[Flumoxd]

Thanks @Billx I'm afraid I can't do that as I don't use webmail save to correct the overzealous spam filter (still, better safe than sorry). However I'll take your advice and see how I can translate it to the headers in Thunderbird. I've already sent the unexpurgated headers to the organisation whose mails are subject to the most delays, and not had any resposes from them at all. Now its time to see if this community can help.

[Billx]

Hi, @Flumoxd 

You can share the message headers on a public forum, proving you hide the 'local-part' of your email address, which is visable in the headers.

After clicking 'View source' in TalkTalk webmail, mark all the headers in the source,

Copy the marked text,

Paste what you have copied into Windows Notepad,

Within Notepad, find all cases of the 'local-part' of your email address (the part before the '@')

and then replace all cases of the 'local-part' to something like 'Flumoxd-local-part'

I don't think anyone would be able to identify you, if you then posted the new version of the headers, to the public forum.

Similar would apply, if you are using an email client.

You can do the same, for the sender of the email.