A method I have discovered of mapping WIFI signal strength...

[MichaelEH]

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I emailed this message to TALKTALK back in January this year but have had no response, and so I thought I would post it here and see if I get any response from the TALKTALK tech department…

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From: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

To: TALKTALK tech support dept. 

       attn Ralph/Melody/any supervisor who can share this info with TALKTALK Tech Department. 

I just wanted to communicate a small breakthrough which I thought you might want to use with your other customers...and also ask two questions of you - see below in bold.

Context: I have for a few months now been suffering from slow internet speeds to my laptop using WIFI. We confirmed that the incoming line to my property was fine and delivering a healthy 40gbps download speed. But the issues I was having in internet speed seemed therefore to be down to WIFI congestion, within my property. This seemed to be resolved in January with an update of my WIFI router (Sage m com fast 5364) which was given the software update from last November which I had missed. 

The problem of slow (i.e. as slow as less than 1mbps - 5mbps) download speeds seemed to have been conclusively solved, but then, in a few weeks, I started to experience slow internet download speeds once more, I rang TALKTALK engineering once more and was able to confirm that my incoming line speed was good and so the problem must be within my property...this time, shutting down and rebooting my laptop (mac book pro early 2013 retina running OS 10.14.6) seemed to clear the speed issues and I was back up to around the 30mbps down load speed.

Then last night I again started to experience slow download speeds via WIFI at my laptop. I use it two (small) rooms away from my kitchen where the router is sitting, on a worktop. I started to read an article https://uk.pcmag.com/wireless-networking/9609/10-ways-to-boost-your-wi-fi-signal about WIFI speed issues which was very insightful. Having already experimented quite extensively with the position of the WIFI booster you gave me, without being able to attribute any difference in WIFI speed to it, and switching it on and off, I now viewed the article diagram on how the WIFI signal can vary throughout a property. One thing I considered was switching my router to work on 5GHZ frequency, and seeing if, in conjunction with the booster, I could achieve a better WIFI signal at my laptop location compared to the 2.4GHz frequency... So to this end I worked out how to log into my WIFI router software and looked at the software setup. I noted that there were two channels that appeared to be available, but not on the same frequency: one was 2.4GHZ and the other 5GHZ. I could see my router was currently connected to my television via ethernet and wirelessly to my laptop and phone. I decided not to try to change the router settings to make it work on 5GHZ since I was not sure if it was already in a position to choose between the 2.4Ghz(ch11) or 5GHZ(ch36) channels operating on different frequencies. So, I resolved to wait and speak to TALKTALK first. I did however, make a change, setting each channel to "auto", since I wanted to make sure the router was able to choose the best channel and so the 2.4GHZ channel 11 became "auto (current channel 11)" and the 5GHz ch36 became "auto (current ch36)". 

Now, I noticed, on my mobile phone, which was on the desk next to the lap top, the icon for WIFI strength (the little parachute) was showing "poor"...and furthermore, I noticed that I could get an immediate change in reading from the phone, on WIFI signal strength as I moved about the room and between rooms... So now I had the equivalent of a WIFI diagram of my property, or at least a way of mapping that diagram - in my hand...just like a radiation giga counter or an avalanche transceiver...! I worked out that my phone (Android) had a four point scale for WIFI signal strength: 1 poor, 2 fair, 3 good and 4 excellent, each with a little "parachute" icon increasingly full. So now it was a relatively simple task to position the WIFI booster so that, at my computer work station, the WIFI signal strength on my phone was reading "good" rather than "poor" and sure enough, getting a WIFI signal strength of "good" next to my computer resulted in a consistent top download speed via WIFI of 37mbps using the TALKTALK.HELP speed checker on my laptop. 

At this stage I don't know if getting a good WIFI signal is the same thing as eliminating WIFI congestion or if WIFI congestion can still be a problem despite good “signal strength”. From my experience so far, it would seem that the former is true.  So far I have consistently found that having a "good" WIFI signal strength reading on my phone when next to my computer, coincides with a 37mbps(the best I can get) down load speed using the TALKTALK online speed checker(TALKTALK.HELP page). Furthermore, I have at last been able to consistently account for the changes due to my WIFI booster, since in its present position (only about a foot further down the corridor nearer the my laptop than before) if I switch it off, I can see a reduction of WIFI i signal to "fair"/"poor" at my computer, and a corresponding dip in download speeds down to between less than 1mbps to early 20s. Switching the booster back on restores the WIFI signal reading back to "good" and a consistent download speed of 37mbps, after a few minutes of waiting. 

Thus, if eliminating WIFI congestion is the same thing as having a good WIFI signal, I think I have cracked the problem at this point! I seem to have located the best place for the WIFI booster by using my mobile phone readout. I will keep monitoring the situation over the coming weeks and will let you know if this system breaks down. At the moment It is a big relief for me since, as I explained, I rely on a swift internet connection for responding to work requests ahead of competitors. 

Furthermore, I was thinking, you could perhaps use this WIFI signal mapping technique with your other customers, (with for course a small commission for me...no, just kidding!) when looking for the best placement for a WIFI booster unit. Should work for anyone with an android phone...and I am sure apple phones have almost the same thing for measuring WIFI signal strength…

I look forward to hearing your thoughts.

Best regards,

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

In particular with respect to two questions posed above:

1. Does my router switch between channels on difference frequencies (i.e. between 2.4GHZ and a 5GHZ channels) or dos it only switch between channels on the same frequency? (4/4/24 I am now sure that the frequency only changes when the device is close to the router or if you switch 2.4Ghz off and so force the router to work on 5Ghz. I have found that the channel within each frequency is changed from time to time by the router, presumably in response to congestion information)

1. Is having good WIFI signal strength, the same thing as eliminating WIFI congestion...? Or can you still be subject to WIFI congestion problems even if you have a strong WIFI signal? …I refer to this issue in my first post made earlier today          

[KeithFrench]

Hi @Michelle-TalkTalk @MichaelEH 

This has been one of the most complex investigations I have undertaken for TalkTalk, although the problem, when found was easy to rectify.

The customer not only has two Sagemcom FAST266s connected in a mesh network with his router, but also has the older TalkTalk WiFi Extender (D-Link DHP-W610AV) connected to an Ethernet port somewhere on this mesh network.

I reported a bug with the D-Link DHP-W610AV a long time ago, where both the 2.4 & 5GHz bands of this WiFi Extender still broadcast these WiFi signals. However, the D-Link gradually reduces its throughput within the extender unit itself. Any Ethernet connection through it remains unaffected by this bug. I am still waiting for D-Link to release a firmware update that rectifies this situation.

The customer has been using devices in the same room as this D-Link DHP-W610AV and connected to its WiFi, rather than the nearest mesh extender node (everything sharing the same SSID). Therefore the connection would experience a gradual decay of its speed over time. This extender was still required to get an Ethernet connection to a TV, therefore I got the customer to disable the WiFi on this extender & he now has a reliable wireless connection, with speeds relative to his fibre's speed.

[Michelle-TalkTalk]

Hi Michael,

Thank you for the update and please let us know how you get on.

Michelle

[MichaelEH]

10/04/24 

Well, I've just been up most of the night working on this problem...of wifi speed dropping down to less than 1mbps down load within an hour or so as described previously in this post... Or rather should I say arriving at the solution, which is where I feel I am at now! 

Keith French has been massively helpful with his input of technical knowledge, and I have added to that a systematic/scientific approach to trying solutions and testing theories...

So, as briefly as I can, here is a (final!?) summary. Problem described in post above was deemed by the talktalk home visit engineer as solvable by adding a second Fast 266 wifi booster. This arrived last Friday and I hooked it up and experimented with the optimum place to locate it in the corridor of my small flat. My flat is a linear layout with front room with TV at one end, Kitchen with router in the middle and bedroom with macbook pro laptop computer at the other end. So, second 266 was placed about 1.5m nearer the router compared to first one which is outside my bedroom door, in line of sight with computer. Both rooters had optimum green and white lights.

I was now getting maximum possible wifi speeds at my computer in my bedroom (37.4mbps) and this carried on for the weekend. At this point I had just joined the community here and Keith French was explaining that two routers was not a way to combat plummeting wifi speed since this was probably caused by wifi interference/congestion.  A strong signal (supplied by two boosters) was not the solution to the catastrophic regular loss of speed I had been having. We explored my set up and Keith told me about a known firmware glitch with certain TalkTalk wifi extenders/Power Line Adaptors such as the one I had connecting the router to my TV, which could also cause a drop off of wifi speed. 

At this stage I was very happy to soak up all the new information and wifi theory, knowing that my system was working perfectly. I work in TV broadcasting so am naturally interested in the way broadband works and of course any help with my home situation, having been struggling with it on and off since last Autumn. However, I was convinced that the second router had been a silver bullet solution to my reoccurring problem of loss of wifi speed, which now seemed to be banished. 

Then on Sunday night the problem came back again and once more wifi speed decayed down to less than 1gbps, not enough to open an email...so back to the repetitive switching on and off of the wifi at the desktop of my laptop and repetitive loading, reloading and running of the TalkTalk.help speed checker until the speed jumped back up to 37mbps...which would last about an hour and then start again... 

The next two days were spent, in between doing other important life tasks - like going to work and taking my Mum for a hospital check up - investigating my wifi setup. 

I renamed the devices in the online map of my router, having already got proficient at logging into my router website, and looking at the windows for: "devices", "mesh" and "extenders", and it is worth doing this so that your not constantly having to look at numbers:

TalkTalk.help in the search bar gets you to support links window - access your router (mine Sagemcom Fast 5364) - log in(find out online how to online) - middle window, wifi settings - manage advanced settings - cog to get into either 2.4 or 5GHz - wifi mesh - devices ...and you get the black button option to rename your devices...works very well once you have navigated there!

Essential tech terms! :

SSID = service set identifier basically the name and source of a wifi network/signal

AP access point = somewhere a device can pick up a wifi signal

BSSID = basic service set ID - a device sending a wifi signal and the other devices that are receiving that signal so a network. note: the name is a set of numbers in the same format as a MAC address...but is not!

Then, as already described, downloading onto my phone wifi analyser aps including... "Wifi Analyser" - Android - is simplest, does the job and is free. However we now found that my phone only worked in 2.4GHz frequency band and, since the second 266 booster allowed my computer start started receiving on the 5GHz bandwidth, the next stage was to down load 'Netspot' analyser (free) to my Macbook pro and this would be able to see 5GHz wifi signals... At this point I had already sent Keith numerous screen shots of my router windows and screen shots of windows of the wifi analyser ap results from my phone...

Meanwhile, depressingly, the fading to nothing wifi signal phenomenon continued... At one point, on a "nothing", whilst operating on one 266 booster and the router , I switched on the second booster and noted that this addition had no effect on increasing the wifi speed...the only way to get the speed to 'snap' back up to 37mbps download was the laborious ritual of switching on and off of the wifi on the computer and loading and reloading and trying to run the (TalkTalk.help) speed checker...

Last night after working late I got home and installed Netspot on my mac (scary warning about damaged software but over-rode the warning and nothing has shown up on virus scans since!) and with this I could see all the wifi devices on both 2.4 as well as 5GHz freq. bands, as well as a time flow graph that shows up signal strength/noise of the networks and breaks in the signal where I had switched on and off my laptop wifi...

Note: at this time I was just learning, thanks to Keith, the difference between BSSIDs and MAC addresses...there is a BSSID for each router and booster that represents the device and the ones it sends to... and there is a different BSSID in each wave band...so for my router and two 266 boosters there were six BSSIDs to note down...Once again: it is different from the MAC address though that is what it looks like!

Keith and I had discussed the possibility that my Power Line Adaptor (connecting the internet to my TV set top box from my router via ethernet and mains plug points as far as I was concerned) might be sending out wireless signals which could be interfering with those of the router and 266 booster(s) and the more I thought of it this was something to eliminate from the equation...

When I got home from work, having sent Keith off a round of screen shots from Net spot and the router, I investigated the PLA and found that it had ethernet cables at both ends ie router to mains plug and TV end, mains plug to set top box... But, as discussed I investigated how to log onto it's website, and found the instructions on the net, how you use the IP address and the password from the larger of the two boxes to log in...eventually got there and amongst all the pages was one that showed the PLA(D-Link) network which did indeed, despite being wired with ethernet cables, broadcast a wifi signal, both in 5 and 2.4GHz! ...a bit more searching revealed a page where you could disable the wifi...this I then quickly did and closed down. Now the tests: Yes, the TV could still communicate with the internet since catch up was working... Before I logged into the PLA user interface I had gone through the time honoured ritual of getting the wifi speed up to 37mbps and, having switched off the PLA's wifi I was happy to see that the wifi signal from the router via the one 266 booster I was using, had not been affected... I then sent Keith a third round of screenshots from the PLA and turned in in the early hours of this morning! 

So; a second period of waiting has begun. Since disabling the PLA's wifi signal, I have had non of the frequent losses of wifi speed at my computer, currently using just one 266 booster which results in the router allowing 5GHz to be used to send to the Macbook pro computer. So far so good....has been more than half a day trouble free. If the problem never comes back then we can say it was down to the wifi coming from the D-Link PLA in some way...which makes sense since the current problems started when I installed the new PLA last September.  The apparent solution of adding the second 266 booster lasted about two days before the (interference??) problem came back, so it's now a case of watch this space... I am due to speak with the Talktalk tech department tomorrow and so if the system is still free of problems that will be something...

I hope some of this description can be of use if you are wrestling with your own wifi set up...

Good luck!

MH     

[Chris-TalkTalk]

OK Michael, please let us know how you get on

Chris

[MichaelEH]

Hi there Michelle,

Just to update you and the post here, I have been in touch with Keith trying to work out what is going on with my WIFI set up... Have discovered that my laptop (Macbook pro) is connecting on 5GHz, and my phone is on 2.4GHz. The phone works fine and all the issues I have been having are with the WIFI speeds to my laptop, which is what I primarily use to access the internet. Since the phone cannot look at 5GHz, all the software aps I have downloaded to it are redundant, but tonight when I get home I will try to download NetSpot to my Macbook pro and see what that reveals about my 5GHz environment...

The main bit of news is that the same problem of WIFI speed decaying to next to nothing returned, last night...and this affects my laptop...so must be to do with the 5GHz frequency...(?) So that is a shame. The second Fast 266 booster was not the silver bullet solution we were hoping for...which is what Keith said from the beginning when I told him I had got it.  I will be able to have a look at what the NetSpot ap reveals for 5GHz WIFI to my lap top, this evening hopefully, when I get home after work... 

Best regards,

Michael 

[KeithFrench]

Hi @Michelle-TalkTalk 

The limiting factor here is the mobile phone, it only supports the slower 2.4GHz band as there is nothing picked up on the 5GHz band. It only has a data link speed (from phone to router) of 72Mbps. Whilst that might seem OK as the fibre is about 40Mbps download, WiFi has a lot of overheads, which will drastically reduce the actual speed between phone & router.

[KeithFrench]

Hi @Michelle-TalkTalk 

I am still waiting for the customer to supply me with analyser screenshots.

[Michelle-TalkTalk]

Hi Michael,

Thanks for your post. How is your wireless connection at the moment?

Michelle

[MichaelEH]

This is further to my post above where I talking about having discovered how I can map my WIFI coverage in my flat by using my mobile phone's normal WIFI setting, while monitoring my router WIFI signal... That was last week, and I have learnt a lot over the last few days...so let me give the obvious steer to anyone who is considering such a task and is not yet enlightened! ...there are all sorts of phone aps, many free, that you can easily download and immediately start to build a picture of your WIFI environment that will be more comprehensive then simply looking at the strength as above with your phones WIF setting... Here is  a link to a very useful review of five WIFI analysis aps...I now have four of them on my phone!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQYPKh32PDE

Enjoy!

MH  

[MichaelEH]

Thanks for that Kieth, I have read a bit about mesh networks and touched on backhaul networks but I need to read more 

Best,

MH

[KeithFrench]

A mesh network has 2.4, 5 & possibly 6GHz (if WiFi 6E) bands for the user plus any guest networks. The 266 is WiFi 6, but the router is still WiFi 5. The mesh nodes all have to connect together obviously, this is the backhaul network & is not available to the user. The backhaul network carries user data between mesh nodes and also inter-mesh management traffic such as status info & topology changes etc. This backhaul is normally done over WiFi using hidden SSIDs with a similar BSSID to those of the front haul networks the user can use. It can be done via Ethernet connections, but that has not been tested on the 266. 

[MichaelEH]

Understood, re re checking on WIFI optimisation. I think mine must be on and so that is how I would prefer it so all good there. 

Can you enlighten me as to what 'backhaul' is...? 

MH

[KeithFrench]

You can neither see its status nor change it, only TalkTalk can do that for you. If you want it disabled, just ask for this to be done in your reply. However, you must do the factory reset first, otherwise, if you get it disabled & then do the reset, WiFi Optimisation will be enabled again.

[MichaelEH]

Thanks for the reply Kieth,

Will try and keep the answers down in length. Also, for your answer on WIFI strength...is obviously a deeper subject than I imagined! 

I think I have it right then about WIFI optimisation... I think that it is working in my router since I have observed it changing channels by itself. Can you tell me where I can see the setting in the routers online pages...or is it too fiddly to describe?

Best,

MH

[KeithFrench]

One other thing, the 5GHz band, being twice the frequency of the 2.4GHz band, covers half the distance approximately of the 2.4GHz band. The backhaul of the 266 uses the 5GHz band, so won't have a wonderful range. The topology of the router & 266's is dynamically worked out & can be subject to change.

It is not signal strength that matters at all, it is signal quality that is important. This is a measure of a high signal strength combined with low levels of WiFi interference. This can impact the data rate that the adapter gets.

[KeithFrench]

Your posts are too long to fully read. Please keep them shorter.

Will having a strong WIFI signal help to overcome WIFI congestion...? and so help maintain high WIFI speeds...? - No.

WiFi optimisation does what it sees fit & for so many people that is not right.

[MichaelEH]

Sorry Kieth,  One more quickie that you might be able to wrap into your next answer...when you find the time...is concerning the WIFI optimisation on my router...can you clarify I wonder...when enabled (which it is by default) the router can "ignore" any changes to band or Frequency that I make and carry on as it "sees fit" according the parameters it has been set to manage the WIFI environment...?

Have I got that right...? 

Best,

MH

[MichaelEH]

Hi there Kieth, 

Thanks so much for your email and input. That's an amazing amount of information...I've been trying to sort out the issue of my WIFI signal with TalkTalk for months now and have never got this amount of insight! 

Yes of course, you are quite correct I started with a typo...its 40mbps is the incoming line throughput that is displayed when I log into my router online. My apologies also for the length of my text...I typed it back in January as both an announcement of my method of mapping the wifi speed speeds inside my property using my mobile phone, but I also tagged some questions to TalkTalk onto the end... I must also say, I feel I have gained a bit in knowledge since I wrote the text.

This afternoon I took delivery of my second Sage m com Fast 266 WIFI booster...and have spent the last 2-3 hours both getting the WIFI up and running by my laborious system of switching the laptop wifi on and off at the desktop, continually launching and relaunching the speed test and then even button rebooting and pinhole rebooting the router... Then, having "freed up" the WIFI signal in my house (is this all due to congestion...?) back to 37mbps speed to my lap top with my existin 266 booster, I proceeded to log how they worked separately and and together and where, until I arrived at at positions for both 266 boosters that give an "excellent" description in my wifi router online "mesh" page.

Some hard evidence I found this afternoon working with the two boosters and my 5364 router: Without either 266 booster running, so just the router, I am getting speeds of 11-20mbps download (6-8 upload) to my laptop, two rooms(always) away from my router which was operating on 2.4GHz frequency(5GHz saying no devices attached). With one 266 booster running, I was getting WIFI speeds of 21/8mbps down/up to 37/9 down up. The online display of the mesh page for 2.5GHz in in the router saying "good" as the connection wirelessly to my computer (macbookpro)

Then, with both boosters running, I found firstly, that they don't fight each other luckily (a TP Link extender I tried yesterday just seemed to clash with the 266 and speeds crashed with them both running). Eventually after experimenting with different positions (during which I could see online the router "passing" the two WIFI devices between them...I have made screen shots of the router online pages for all the stages so I can show TALKTALK, who were even disputing how many devices I had running!) I managed to get "excellent" as the description of the WIFI connection to both 266 boosters in the router's online "mesh" window. Furthermore, for the first time, I noted that the two WIFI connected devices (my phone -Motorola G8 - and my computer) were now showing as connected in both 5GHz as well as in 2.4GHz...

I was fascinated to read your description of how the router works...and that the WIFI devices can be carried on either 2.4 or 5GHz bands and various possible channels at the "choice" of the router... I have asked TALKTALK about this many times by never got a full answer as to how the router works. Having said that, it is only today that I have found the router 'talking' to devices on more that one band, before it has been only on 2.4GHz, or , when I shut 2.4 down, on 5GHz. So that is fascinating to see, and thank you so much for your description of how the router works...As I say, I have been trying to build up an accurate picture for a long time... 

From my observations today, I will hold off on doing a reset as you mentioned to counter the firmware bug for the moment... It looks like the router is doing its "band steering" job correctly at this point. I got last November's firmware update late this January, so I think I must have the latest (V174?) you described.

As well as WIFI speed as measured using the online TALKTALK speed checker...my current problem is that (for the last few weeks) the WIFI speed dies off after about an hour or so, to a fraction of a mbps...and I cannot do anything online...not refresh my email page, not view any websites, not load the speed checker etc etc. I then spend up to around an hour continuously clicking my desktop WIFI on and off and trying to load and run the online speed checker (via TALKTALK.HELP) or also button rebooting or pinhole rebooting the router until eventually the WIFI speed springs back to 36 or 37mbps down load speed...and this has been going on for weeks now... So the next stage after this afternoons experimentation will be to wait an hour or two and see if the second 266 booster has any effect on the loss of WIFI speed phenomenon... 

Then finally, my question re WIFI signal strength. Is it an indication of whether you have overcome WIFI congestion...ie strong signal overcomes congestion and vice versa?? I an not quite sure if I understand what you are saying... Perhaps I can put it again to you as I just have... Will having a strong WIFI signal help to overcome WIFI congestion...? and so help maintain high WIFI speeds...?

Let me put one piece of evidence (presented in my second post made at the same time as the above one) which is that, when I was monitoring the WIFI speed/loss there of, using the 2.5MHz band (at the time I had been told by TALKTALK that the router would only work on 2.5GHz unless I got my computer closer to the router and I could see that the router online was showing no devices on the 5GHz band) I was positioning the 266 booster so that, as measured on my mobile phone, the WIFI signal strength at my computer was as great as I could get it ("strong"/"excellent")...but I still was experiencing the speed decay down to next to nothing (0.5mbps download) in around an hour....and then the laborious switching process for around an hour to get the speed to snap back to 37mbps down load. Now here's the interesting bit. When I forced the router to work on 5GHz by disabling the 2.4band, I was able as described to get the WIFI speed (as measured on the TALKTALK online speed checker) to 'snap' back up to 37mbps but now, the signal strength as measured around my laptop by my mobile phone was showing "weak" ...yet I had once more the fast speed of 37mbps which then decayed away to nothing in an hour or so in just the same way as it did when working on 2.4GHz band with a "weak" surrounding signal strength. 

So you see my quandary: I would like to think that a 'strong' signal measured on my mobile phone is an indication of good wifi, but from my experience, it doesn't seem to matter...the WIFI speed just drops off the same way when using 2.4GHz/strong phone-measured signal strength as it does using 5GHz/weak phone-measured signal strength... 

The foot note to this issue will come from the second Fast 266 booster added this afternoon ...I am hoping it will act as a 'silver bullet' to the problem of 'decaying-to-nothing' WIFI speed. Already I can see that the router is now using both frequency bands (2.4 and 5GHz) as never before, and I have just done a speed test and I still have 37mbps down load speed since I started to write this reply...

I will report back with the further results of introducing the second 266 booster but in the mean time, would love to hear your comments in reply to what I have written here, if you can bear it... Thanks once again for your fantastic insight. Has been revelation!

Best regards,

MH         

[KeithFrench]

I think you started with a typo, TalkTalk does not offer a 40Gbps service at all, I think your units are wrong & it should read 40Mbps.

Your letter is long and I am unsure if you understand the principles of 802.11 WiFi, that is not a problem at all, because I can help you with it. However, due to the length of it, apologies if I have missed anything.

Dual-band routers such as the Sagemcom 5364 do support two different frequency bands as you have said, the 2.4 & 5GHz bands.  Let me first explain the advantages & disadvantages of each.

Generally speaking, the 2.4GHz band suffers much more from interference than the 5GHz band, but the 2.4GHz one can sometimes have a better range, but this all depends on your local area. The 5GHz band for WiFi adapters that can use it, offers much faster speeds than the 2.4Ghz band.

The router is configured to use the best WiFi channel that it perceives on each band at startup, but that may well change these over time. It does not stop broadcasting on either band, they are both active all of the time. For example, it might start out using these channels:-

2.4GHz - channel 1

5GHz channel 36

Over time it might change to perhaps:-

2.4GHz - channel 6

5GHz channel 48

What might well happen is that any devices that connect initially to the 2.4GHz band, which also supports the 5GHz band, might be moved over to the faster 5GHz band via a feature called Band Steering. However, certain criteria including signal strength are taken into account. Equally, if the device moves further away from the router, Band Steering might decide it would serve that device better to move it over to the 2.4GHz band until it moves closer to the router again.

However, there is one thing that might be a problem with what you have done. Your Sagemcom FAST5364 router I assume is running firmware V174? I think in your letter you mentioned about disabling one band. If I misread it then I apologise, but there is a bug in this version of firmware that when you re-enable the band it will not do this correctly and this is made worse when it is connected to the Sagemcom FAST 266 WiFi Booster, which I assume is the booster that you refer to? In this case, the only workaround is to perform a factory reset on the router. V174 is the current firmware version, but there is another version due out sometime later this year.

Taking your other question:-

Is having good WIFI signal strength, the same thing as eliminating WIFI congestion...? Or can you still be subject to WIFI congestion problems even if you have a strong WIFI signal?

The simple answer is not at all, other than to say signal strength can be impacted by congestion or WiFi interference. One is not an indication of the other.

Slow speed, intermittent dropouts, breaks in the signal or no signal on some or all devices or no internet access might be caused by 802.11 Wi-Fi interference from other local networks, which can also lead to a permanent reduction in speed. No ISP can be responsible for your local environment, this is mainly a byproduct of the popularity of Wi-Fi.

Have you had TalkTalk’s Wi-Fi optimisation disabled on your Sagemcom FAST5364/5464 router? When this is enabled, as it is by default, it has the power to override any Wi-Fi configuration changes that might be made by the user.  Only TalkTalk can disable this for you, you cannot do it yourself. If not, just request they disable this for you in your reply.

If you want further help, I can offer this. I can try to help you optimise your Wi-Fi connection. The next stage involves sending out a guide to you to help you get me some important diagnostic results so that I can analyse them for you and recommend changes to your router configuration to solve them.

I only send this out to people who request it.

[KeithFrench]

Hi @MichaelEH 

I can help you with all aspects of WiFi.

The information below is provided by TalkTalk, for confirmation please contact @Debbie-TalkTalk or@Michelle-TalkTalk.

KeithFrench is one of our valued Community Stars and can help with a range of issues related to wireless and networking. At times he may ask you to send him test results via a Private Message to help analyse/diagnose an issue. Although Keith does not work for TalkTalk, he very kindly shares his time and knowledge to help with others.

If you need further help or, if we need to take any details such as personal information about your account like phone numbers, account numbers etc. one of the TalkTalk team will jump in and help out.

I will answer your questions in a second reply below this one, otherwise it might get too long.