Fibre 65 and VOIP

[jerryf]

I would be grateful if anyone could advise on the following two questions:

• Is VOIP technically feasible over FTTC connections?
• Does TT intend to only offer Digital Voice to customers who upgrade to a Full Fibre contract?

Background

I currently have Fibre 65 broadband contract delivered over Openreach’s FTTC network which ends in August this year.

In response to a recent query regarding FTTP deployment in my location, Openreach responded:

• I’ve looked into the availability of full fibre FTTP service to Mr Foster’s property and unfortunately, we don’t have any immediate commercial fibre broadband deployment plans that would benefit his location. I know this will be disappointing and I’m really sorry I’ve not got better news to give.
•  We do have potential plans to deliver FTTP to the local exchange area (which serves Mr Fosters area). As you can appreciate there is a lot of work needed so this will take us some time to do, and this programme will be phased over the next three years.
•  For any area where FTTP is not available on our network [like in Mr Fosters case] an alternative digital service would be offered.   (I think this was referring to PSTN alternative under Universal Service Obligation)
  

When I check FTTP availability on TT’s website using my postcode I simply get a blank response screen and no other information.

At present BT still plan to shutdown the PSTN service by end 2025 and are already migrating customers to Digital Voice delivered over both FTTC and FTTP networks.

At the moment TT only offer VOIP services to customers using their Full Fibre products.

Based on Openreach’s response above it seems possible that the PSTN could be shutdown before Openreach make a decision to upgrade the buried copper “last leg” of my FTTC connection to provide an FTTP option.  I understand that the FTTC network itself will remain operational until it is eventually retired, which could be a considerable time beyond end-2025.

[jerryf]

Here is an update on my efforts to get definitive answers regarding TT's Fibre 65 and PSTN shutdown.

I sent the attached letter to TT Customer Relations.  The reply suggested my query was about full fibre services (it wasn't) and should contact TT's specialist team using either Chat Online or call directly.  Chat Online appears to be a BOT with limited functionality so called direct.

The answers I received were:

1.  TT would not continue to provide analogue telephone services to existing landline customers after BT shutdown the PSTN.  The only option would be to upgrade to Full Fibre even though VOIP can be delivered over FTTC networks which are likely to continue operating for several years after PSTN shutdown.

2.  Although TT have arrangements with CityFibre to deliver Full Fibre that does not extend to toob, their strategic partner, who have just installed their own 900 Mbs Full Fibre network along our road.  Given that Openreach may choose not to replace the existing FTTC infrastructure to my property with Full Fibre the service agent agreed that I would have no option but to move provider if I wanted access to VOIP via TT's Full Fibre services.

If anyone elase has any more reliable or up to date information I would be happy to see it.

[KeithFrench]

Hi @jerryf 

My comments about TT not cutting old landlines off by 2025, is purely down to things I have read. I can't give you any guarantees that their policy will not change.

[Gliwmaeden2]

Talktalk seems to have deals for full fibre installations in some areas with Openreach, in others with City Fibre, or again other Altnets in other areas, so very much a patchwork of installation companies, unlike the current legacy of Openreach for copper right across the country, @jerryf.

Pretty random from the customer's point of view, currently, so no guarantee that Talktalk will do a deal with City Fibre in your area, just because they do in another one nearby.

[jerryf]

Hi DAB1011

Many thanks for confirming my own understanding that VOIP is feasible under FTTC.

Just that TT choose not to offer it on Fibre 65 which might be due to reliability or other issues around FTTC or an incentive to upgrade.

Jerry

[jerryf]

Hi Keith

My question was prompted by statements from Ofcom, Which and Age UK suggesting that customers wishing to retain a landline telephone service would need to migrate to Digital Voice (VOIP) before BT's  shutdown of PSTN scheduled for Dec 2025.

Your reply indicates that my understanding is incorrect, so just to confirm:

• TalkTalk will continue to provide my Fibre 65 analogue landline telephone service beyond PSTN closure without the need to upgrade to a Full Fibre contract or migrate to VOIP?

As a follow-on questions:

• I presume that when Openreach retire the local copper network element of my FTTC connection I would then have to change to a Full Fibre contract, including migration to VOIP - is this correct?
• Will TT terminate Fibre 65 renewals before Openreach retire the local FTTC copper network?

Your reply regarding SIP phones confused me slightly but I presume you mean that if I went to another provider for VOIP, given that TT do not offer it as a service on Fibre 65 (not sure why), then that would be at additional cost and a new phone number.  However,  would I need new handsets if I could not find a suitable adapter for the TT router I currently use.

Regards

Jerry

I am aware of Altnets as toob(City Fibre) have just installed a number of telegraph poles/live fibre along our road and we are now being "encouraged" on a weekly basis to take up their broadband only service (no email, VOIP etc included).  Given that TT already use CityFibre infrastructure I am not sure why TT's Full Fibre post code checker doesn't give any results or indication that Full Fibre is or soon will be available where I live.

[DAB1011]

Yes Voip can be used.  I use it myself.

I have a Grandstream HT-802 ATA (£45) connected directly to the Talktalk router, to which I connect a Panasonic DECT and a BT venue analogue phones.

I have an account with Voipfone at a cost of £3.60 a month with call charges of 1p a minute for land line and 3p per minute for calls to Mobile.

Hope this helps

D. A. Brown

[KeithFrench]

TalkTalk is independent, having their own equipment, so the date for the shutdown does not mean that you will lose your service. Just because Openreach are not planning anything yet, they are no longer the only providers of full fibre. TT use CityFibre and various other Altnets as they are called such as Freedom Fibre. Your road may be served by one of these.

Yes it is technically possible to use VOIP, but not using your landline number. This would involve you purchasing SIP phones & using a SIP provider somewhere, all at your own expense. I have no idea what the call costs would be.