Wifi optimisation

[andyrhi]

Hi, can you turn off the wifi optimisation on our router please? It keeps kicking our phones and tv off the wifi.

[andyrhi]

We're just on Fibre 65. Does that make a difference?

Hmm, what do we use wifi for?

Phones, Hive heating, smoke alarm, talktalk tv box, chromecast, laptops. I'd probably have to check each one would work OK.

But yes, wifi optimisation would just take it back wouldn't it.

[KeithFrench]

The Sagemcoms do not deliver a weak signal at all, in fact, they are better than quite a few. I think you are very unlucky with your neighbour's router locations.

Yes, you could change channels to 52 or higher still, assuming that all of your 5GHz devices are DFS compatible. Channel 149 would be even better, but again not all devices may work on such a high channel. However ......... WiFi Optimisation will probably move you back again.

Please remind me, what package are you on?

[andyrhi]

Hi Keith,

Understood. Both the router and F266 are quite far away from the party wall. I can only assume their kit is mega strong, maybe ours is feeble.

Is there anything to be said for changing channels and somehow persuading talktalk to turn off wifi optimisation? Or will that have no impact at all?

Would we have the same issues with a different router as well?

Thanks

Andy

[KeithFrench]

Yes on further investigation, my previous post outlined the problem with the back room reception from the F266's 5GHz band.

I don't really know what else you can practically do, other than try moving the 266. I bit tongue-in-cheek, but you could always put some metal sheeting up on the walls where the other routers' signals are strongest!

[KeithFrench]

Hi @andyrhi 

I have just had a very quick look at the signal strength of the 266's 5GHz band is terrible here. It is also being obliterated by the network ending in 6R which I mentioned in my PM.  I can only assume that this is a neighbour whose router is physically very close to your back room. I can only suggest trying to move the F266 a bit?

I'll have a better look later today.

[andyrhi]

Thanks Keith, much appreciated 

[KeithFrench]

Thanks @andyrhi 

I'll look at it this afternoon now.

[andyrhi]

Hi Keith

Here's a new report from the back room.

Thanks

Andy

[KeithFrench]

Hi @andyrhi 

Just to sum up the PM that I have sent you, minus the details of other networks with stronger signal strength than yours.

In the 2.4GHz band on channel 11, there are three networks that are stronger than the one from your F266 booster. I appreciate that at the point of capture on your PC you are much closer to your router than the 266.

The 5GHz band from the F266 is once again obliterated by some other networks.

Please can you get me another set of traces in the back room where you are using the F266 to improve reception?

Keith

[andyrhi]

Ok, no problem. Thanks

[KeithFrench]

Hi @andyrhi 

I am going to ask you about a couple of networks, so it is probably best if I do this via a PM.

[andyrhi]

Hi Keith,

Massive apologies that it's taken me this long to move the router and do a report. Had a couple of disasters over the past 2 weeks.

I understand if you don't feel inclined to look at it after this time. If you do, then I am very grateful, of course.

I've moved the router to the next room and run the report from my original location. So it's not a huge move yet.

Thanks

Andy

[KeithFrench]

Hi @andyrhi 

If it's built-in, treat it as PCIe. Find the adapter in Device Manager, click on the Power Management tab, and untick Allow the computer to turn off this device to save power. 

When you move the router get me a new ZIP from the location where you were originally, nearer to the router, not the back of the house.

[andyrhi]

Hi Keith

I've turned off the setting on the PC. Wifi card is built in, not on a USB or anything like that.

However, that wouldn't account for the phones showing 'connected with no internet' or words to that effect; and the tv box getting disconnected?

I'll try moving the router a bit tomorrow.

Any other ideas?

[KeithFrench]

Hi @andyrhi 

The only real interference that I can see is on the 2.4GHz band whilst it is using channel 6 from this network:-

SSID: BT-XXXXX         (BSSID: XXXXXXXXXXX)

This might be a neighbour who has a BT Home Hub? Its signal strength (-46dBm) is too close to your SSID on channel 6, which is at -33dBm. However, you didn't have anything connected to this band when you took this trace for me, the other three devices are connected to the 5GHz band.

Normally the 266 will follow the channel used by the router & will probably have changed to channel 1 by now.

There is a problem though, with the signal strength from the router in your first set of traces. The 2.4GHz band keeps dropping, it is impossible to see the 5GHz band in the signal strength graph, as it seems to be masked by other networks. I think this dropping out of the 2.4 & possibly the 5GHz band is your problem. This might cause WiFi Optimisation to go into overdrive to try & sort this issue. 

If you are using a USB Wi-Fi adapter, use a USB socket on the front of the PC, as there is more open space around it than at the rear. If a USB extension cable is used, try to ensure that it is fairly short, so that the power from the computer is not attenuated. Long extension cables can cause the adapter to not have enough power from the computer to work correctly.

The next thing to rule out is if this is related to Windows Power Management on your WiFi adapter (USB or PCIe). However, I would expect all other networks to drop at the same time, some do and some don't. This should be ruled out anyway.

To check this in Windows 10 or 11, open Device Manager and expand Network adapters. Then right-click your WiFi card & select Properties. Next, click on the Power Management tab and untick Allow the computer to turn off this device to save power. If the adapter is connected via USB, then expand the USB section in Device Manager. The same option can be found in the Power Management tab in most Root Hubs and USB Controllers. Untick it in there as well. 

Once you have made the changes outlined below, it is probably best to restart the PC.

Then another option is to try moving the router, with Full Fibre this is not that difficult. All you need is a longer Cat 6 Ethernet cable between the router & the ONT. It can always be hidden in white plastic self-adhesive trunking.

[Michelle-TalkTalk]

Thanks for your help Keith.

Michelle

[andyrhi]

Thank you for your help Keith

[KeithFrench]

Hi @andyrhi 

I'll try & have a look at this later tomorrow now, as I have no more time today.

[andyrhi]

Hi Keith

Here's the report from the back room.

Thanks

[KeithFrench]

Hi @andyrhi 

Looking at these, channel 1 in the 2.4GHz should actually be OK as, even though there are a lot of networks in this band, they do seem to mainly conform to the 1, 6 or 11 channel rules. You have enough headroom over the other networks on this channel. The 5GHz band also looks basically OK on 36. The way the 5Ghz band operates is different from the 2.4GHz band in respect of WiFi interference. It takes the whole channel group (in this case 36 to 48 or to be more correct channel 42 in the new 802.11ac channel naming convention) and uses the least congested channel. With the number of channels increasing on demand with 80MHz channel bandwidth, it will use more channels in this band, if it can. When the demand drops off it reverts to just the one channel.

Now all of that relates to where this PC is that is running Wi-Fi scanner and at this point in time (it might get worse at night), other places your property may well differ. If this is a laptop, can you get another set of traces from the very back room that you have mentioned?