Full fibre activation

[Kincavel]

Installation of my full fibre upgrade has just been completed. Before leaving, the engineer informed me that it could take up to twenty-four hours to activate so, for now, I still have BOTH the ONT and my landline connected to my router.

Will I receive any notification of activation, or will I have to check it via trial-and-error disconnection of my landline from my router?

Also, once full fibre becomes active, does data transmission via my landline cease? If so, I infer that I could then remove the 'splitters' from my landline as it would then revert to being a dedicated telephone line. Is that correct?

[Billx]

What a very interesting thread!

What didn't come out of this discussion, with this type of arrangement, that is, with a copper left behind line for voice service only, and an upgrade to Full Fibre Data only for the remaining broadband, is the following question.

Does this result in 2 independent sub-accounts within MyAccount, each with its own contract price, or is the voice only copper line zero-rated, and only the main Full Fibre Data only line,  charged?

Bill

[Chris-TalkTalk]

No problem 🙂

[Kincavel]

No worries. We got there in the end. Thank you for your assistance.

[Chris-TalkTalk]

OK, thanks for the information, I'll feed back your comments. Apologies for any confusion 

Chris

[Kincavel]

Just to put you fully in the picture...

I ended up with three 'visitors' all told. My wife initially answered the door before handing me over to what appeared to be a twelve-year-old. When I got technical, he said it was his first week in the job, so would have to fetch his manager round from the next street. The manager duly pitched up accompanied by a girl who looked about eighteen. From then on, the manager did most of the talking, with occasional input from the twelve-year-old. The girl remained silent throughout.

It was the manager who insisted that, despite now having a working ONT connection, I was actually still on a copper wire service, and recommended that I switch to TalkTalk Fibre 150, which would require a further engineer visit (the reason for which wasn't made very clear, except to imply that an additional cable would need to be run into my property), and the replacement of my router with an Amazon eero. In the process, I would lose my landline telephone, "which nobody uses anyway these days"! When I argued that TalkTalk had assured me that I am on full-fibre broadband following the installation of the fibre cable and ONT, he flat out declared that I wasn't, and told me to tell TalkTalk that "Lawrence" said so!

I don't recall it being mentioned precisely who they worked for, but I did ask the twelve-year-old when "Lawrence" was distracted by a phone call. He briefly flashed his identity badge (which I couldn't read) before claiming that his employers were in partnership with TalkTalk and Openreach. The only package that was mentioned (repeatedly) was TalkTalk Fibre 150, from which I inferred that they were working on TalkTalk's behalf.

I told them there was no way I was signing up for anything until I had contacted TalkTalk directly for clarification, at which point they left, presumably to pester some other poor so-and-so.

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Thanks for the points that you have raised. Just to confirm, did the cold caller definitely say that they were representing TalkTalk?

Chris

[Kincavel]

Taking each of your paragraphs in order...

1. That describes (and therefore confirms) my current configuration precisely.

2. That exactly confirms what I suspected, so I'll just leave the splitters in place for now (no problem).

3. Clear enough, and doesn't apply anyway (as per the postscripts I added to my previous post).

The Fibre 35/Fibre 65 position is still a little unclear to me, but please don't bother taking that any further, as I'm quite happy with my current service (and may upgrade to Fibre 65 in future, which I understand to be very straightforward... and would resolve the 'issue').

...all of which leaves me feeling that it's worth making the following points in closing.

FYI, I come from a technical background myself, having worked in IT for over three decades. I'm a systems designer/developer, not an engineer, so I have more knowledge and experience of software rather than hardware, but I am quite familiar and at ease with home network configuration. I mention this because even I have been confused by some of the 'fallout' from this upgrade... and last night's cold call (one of many taking place in my neighbourhood) could well have resulted in someone less tech-savvy than I am signing up for a more expensive further upgrade that they didn't actually need.

In conclusion, then, I think TalkTalk could have thought through this entire programme with a lot more clarity and efficiency... and I would call into question the morals behind any attempt to use the upgrade as an excuse to drum up custom for further business.

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Regarding cables, the telephone cable should be connected to the old telephone socket as before. The router should be connected to the ONT with a Ethernet cable, the ethernet cable should be connected to the router's WAN port (the telephone shouldn't be connected to the router)

The internet connection over the phone line will probably persist for a short time but it should be regraded to voice only at some point

Regarding what the cold caller said about the router, I assume they were just referring to the fact that the router doesn't have a digital voice port (VoIP), but that isn't required as you don't have a digital voice service

Hope this helps. If you need any more information please let me know

Chris

[Kincavel]

Thanks for your reply. Unfortunately, I was already pretty clear on this to begin with. What I originally wanted to know is whether or not an Internet connection over the phone line will persist. If the upgrade effectively means that there will no longer be any internet traffic over the phone line, there would be no need for me to retain the splitters in the cable (although I accept that it's doing no harm to leave them in place).

Please refer to my previous posts detailing my 'experimentation' with the cables.

Also, the cold call I received last night has muddied the waters even further. What is your response to the queries I raised following on from that?

P.S. I'm now aware that the Amazon eero has just two Ethernet ports, so would require an Ethernet switch if an eero were to be a direct replacement for my current router... and an Ethernet switch would take up an additional mains electric socket. I have no desire to go down that route.

P.P.S. The cold-caller was trying to sell me an upgrade to Fibre 150, which I now understand to be data only (so no phone service)... and is way more than I need anyway.

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Thanks for answering the security question. The service you have is copper leave behind which just means that you'll continue to receive your voice (phone) service over the existing copper cable and broadband will be supplied over the new fibre cable via the ONT. The router that you have will work fine with this service

Chris

[Kincavel]

I've replied to the PM.

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Hi Kincavel,

I've sent you a PM to confirm some details 

Thanks

Chris

[Kincavel]

The plot thickens, which unfortunately means I have more queries and concerns to add, as follows.

I've just had a cold-caller at my door from a company whose name, unfortunately, wasn't made clear, but who apparently are in partnership with TalkTalk and Openreach (not CityFibre, as far as I could tell).

According to him, I am actually still on a copper wire connection despite the installation of my fibre cable and ONT, which is the only connection I am currently using, as already mentioned. He then proceeded to offer me an upgrade to a TalkTalk full fibre package, free for the first three months, based upon an Amazon eero router, BUT...

This would require additonal work from an engineer, and would also lose my copper wire connectivity, including my landline, entirely, so I would be without a landline telephone until such time as suitable alternative technology becomes available. That is totally unacceptable.

TalkTalk's original email offering me the upgrade specifically stated that my existing contract would be unaffected, and indeed I am still on Fibre 35. However, I understand that full fibre only applies to Fibre 65 and above...

...so what exactly have I ended up with?

As far as I was led to believe, all I needed to do following the installation of an ONT was to connect it to the WAN port of my router via an Ethernet cable... which I have done and everything seems to be working exactly as before. Yet my visitor reckons that my current router is (allegedly) incompatible with a 'true' full fibre service and must be replaced!

I am also using a 'wired' home network using Ethernet cables and (except for my desktop PC, which is directly connected to the router) homeplug powerline adapters, and it is unclear to me whether an Amazon eero would 'fit' that configuration or is totally wireless... which I don't want.

I was simply not prepared to enter into any further transactions based upon a rushed conversation on my doorstep, so haven't committed to anything, pending a resolution of these new, and my earlier, queries.

What is becoming clear to me is that TalkTalk simply haven't thought this through at all... and the deafening silence from them would suggest that there are far more questions than answers! 

[Michelle-TalkTalk]

Hi,

Ah right thanks for confirming. This is the Wifi Hub 1 which doesn't have the voice port.

Thanks

[Kincavel]

As I posted on Friday, I don't see anything on the back of my router that I would recognise as a 'voice port'.

I have since determined that my router is a Sagemcom-FAST5364. My landline and ONT cables connect to the broadband and WAN ports, respectively.

[Michelle-TalkTalk]

Morning,

When you say both cables to the router, do you mean connecting the phone at the voice port on the back of the router?

Thanks

[Kincavel]

Hi

I have only the ONT connected to my router as I'm posting this, therefore the fibre connection must be active.

If I were to swap the cables over to reconnect only my landline to the router, I would still have internet access (at least, that was the position yesterday; I haven't tried it since).

In either case, speeds are neither better nor worse than before... but were okay to begin with.

If I were to connect both cables to my router, I would lose internet access as it appears to confuse the router... though, again, I haven't tried it since yesterday.

...and my telephone works okay. 😉

[Michelle-TalkTalk]

Morning,

Apologies for the delay. So can I just confirm, the broadband connection is now working at the ONT? Are the speeds also ok? The voice service works at the copper socket only?

Thanks

[Kincavel]

Earlier today, what turned out to be an entirely unrelated issue with BBC iPlayer prompted further experimentation, as a result of which I have discovered that my fibre connection is now active... despite receiving NO notification from TalkTalk to that effect.

With either the landline or the fibre cable connected to my router, I have internet access.

When both cables are connected I have NO internet access. The light on my router alternately blinks orange and white constantly, as though it cannot decide which connection to choose.

...all of which confirms what I originally assumed, i.e. the landline internet connection remains available even after full fibre is active. It would therefore appear that, while awaiting the resolution of any future issues with the fibre connection, I could fall back to using the landline as a temporary workaround until such time as the 'copper wire' service is eventually retired (I seem to recall someone mentioning this on another forum, hence my original assumption).

...so I cannot dispense with the splitters on my phone wires just yet.

[Kincavel]

Just following on from my last post, reporting a fault can only be done via the TalkTalk website, which obliges you to perform a line test first. Naturally, it is not made clear WHICH line is being tested, but I suspect it will be the landline, NOT the fibre line.

The test revealed a fault with my broadband connection, which comes as quite a surprise, considering that I'm still using it! The reference is REP-12525909.

A subsequent 'chat' (I HATE using those) with a support agent has revealed that my fibre connection should indeed have been activated within twenty-four hours, and a ticket has been raised to investigate the delay and expedite the activation. Turns out that I will be notified once the fibre service is active. As for the transition from 'copper wire'...

My every attempt to discover what happens to the internet element of my landline traffic once fibre has been activated has only resulted in repeated assurances that my telephone will still work! I KNOW THAT!!!

What I want to know is whether or not my landline internet connection will persist. If it does, what would be the impact (if any) of having BOTH a landline AND a fibre connection to my router, owing to the 'duality of signal path'? The obvious solution would be to disconnect my landline from the router (which I would probably do anyway), but I assume I'd be able to reconnect it as a fallback pending any future issues with fibre (at least until the 'copper wire' service is retired).

If, on the other hand, the landline internet connection is automatically switched off as part of the transition to fibre, then the obvious conclusion is that the landline would revert to being a telephone line exclusively... in which case, I could then remove the signal splitters from my phone wires.

Can someone please enlighten me?