WiFi security settings messages and devices offline

[papd63]

Hello,

Please can someone tell me what the message 'WiFi security settings have been successfully saved' in my router log actually means i.e. what is the router doing, and why? The message tends to appear multiple, usually 4, times in quick succession, and I get several groups of messages on most days.

My reason for asking is I've been struggling with my wireless printers frequently going offline at seemingly random times. Internet searches show printer-offline issues are widely reported with various printer models, but none of the suggested fixes work for me. Furthermore my problem is affecting two printers (different models) at varying times. So I decided to take a closer look at what is happening in my case...

I ran a batch script which pings my printer IP addresses every 5 minutes over several days to find out when the problem occurs. By cross-referencing the results against my router's log, I've concluded that my problem is somehow linked to the 'WiFi security...' messages in the router log.

To clarify, my 'WiFi security...' messages are usually followed in the log by all 2.4GHz wifi devices - or less frequently all 5GHz wifi devices - automatically disconnecting and reconnecting from the network, and therefore becoming un-pingable for a short time. This is acceptably brief, and is NOT the problem.

The problem IS:
- one or both of my printers becomes permanently un-pingable (ping returns 'unreachable' response) from any device (like my test laptop on wifi, or wired, or my mobile phone) which disconnects and reconnects to the network, AFTER the 'WiFi security...' messages appear. Subsequent pings continue to fail despite the fact that, according to the log, both test device and printer are successfully connected to the network;
- devices that stay connected to the network after the 'WiFi security...' messages, continue to see the printer until the next time they reconnect;
- the only way I have found to make the printer ping-able again from all devices is to disconnect/reconnect the printer itself.

As said above, the 'WiFi security...' messages are normally followed in the log by all wifi devices on one frequency disconnecting and reconnecting. In practice, this can lead to a scenario where the printer becomes un-pingable after one set of 'WiFi security...' messages, and then becomes pingable again several hours later, through being automatically disconnected and reconnected following another set of 'WiFi security...' messages.

In hindsight, my problems will have have seemed random during daily use because firstly, my newer printer can switch between 2.4/5GHz, and secondly, my main laptop running Windows 11 reconnects to the network every time it wakes from sleep. My testing has eliminated these random elements and my printer-offline problems coincide with the 'WiFi security...' messages every time.

So to help me determine where the root cause lies and how to fix it, please can someone tell me what the router is doing when these messages appear, and why do they happen when they do (what is the trigger)?

[ The back of my router says its a Sagemcom FAST 5364-3.T8. The firmware version is SG4K100174. ]

Many thanks in advance.

[Gliwmaeden2]

@papd63, I have successfully changed the title at the start, but it doesn't seem to apply to subsequent posts.

Not worth worrying about. 

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Hi papd63,

Sorry for the delay, I haven't heard anything further but I'll chase it up.

Regarding the title, I can't see an obvious way to change it unfortunately 

Chris

[papd63]

Hi Chris, I wondered if there is any progress on this please?

I also wanted to add an update of my own:

After more testing, I'm also finding that an android phone which remains awake and connected shows exactly the same behaviour as my printers i.e. it becomes permanently unreachable when continuously pinged from a laptop the next time that laptop disconnects and reconnects to the network after the appearance of 'WiFi security...' messages in the log.

So I'm not sure if its possible to change the subject of my post, but the title should now more correctly say 'devices offline' instead of 'printer' offline.

Thanks.

[papd63]

Ok that's fine Chris, thanks for keeping me posted.

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Hi papd63,

Just a quick update to let you know that are product team are looking into this and I'll let you know when I have an update

Chris

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Thanks, I'll pass this on to our product team, I'll let you know when I receive an update

Chris

[papd63]

Hi Chris,

Thanks for taking up my question with the product team.

Regarding my printers, I have an HP Envy 6032e, bought about 8 months ago to replace my older HP Photosmart C4780 which I've had for years. In case its relevant, the Envy uses HP+ and Instant Ink, so it connects to the internet; it supports both 2.4 and 5ghz wifi. The older Photosmart is 2.4ghz only.

Thanks.

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Hi papd63,

Could you let me know what the make and model numbers of the two printers are

Thanks

Chris

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Hi papd63,

I've asked our product team to take a look at this. I'll let you know when I have an update

Chris

[papd63]

Hi Keith, perhaps I wasn't clear in my last paragraph - I fully accept your previous point that those messages appear when someone saves a wifi configuration setting. However I'm not (knowingly) saving any configuration settings. My phrase "normally... when there is no user action" was in reference to the thread I linked earlier (this one) where the OP said he was getting the same messages as me, when he wasn't doing anything, and the response from the 'product team' said that this was 'normal'.

So I'm hoping one of the TalkTalk OCEs might recall that previous answer from the 'product team' and be able to give some more detail please. Sorry if I wasn't clear.

[KeithFrench]

Hi @papd63 

In response to your last paragraph, I have answered this several times already. Normal - this log entry is made when you have saved any Wi-Fi configuration settings.

[papd63]

Yes I'm happy to try switching off wifi optimisation.

Although please can you clarify, does this wifi optimisation only automatically hop the channels for 2.4 and 5GHz, or does it do more than that? I've only seen some automatic channel hopping in the logs in the last 4 days, once a day at most, and before that the router seemed stable with no channel hopping, so that alone would seem an unlikely cause of my issues - although I'm happy to be proved wrong.

Perhaps a more likely cause might be some of my devices moving between 2.4 and 5, which seems to happen more frequently for me, so would switching off wifi optimisation also have an affect on that?

If possible I'd still appreciate more clarity on what 'normally' causes the 'Wifi security...' messages when there's no user action, so please can someone seek an answer on that in parallel? (it might help focus my testing to save me some time, or might help someone else in the future)

[Anonymous]

Morning,

Would you like us to try switching off the wifi optimisation first to see how this compare?

Thanks

[papd63]

May I just point out this post, albeit a little old, but I think its the same router as mine, and the messages are certainly the same.

Like me, the OP says they were getting the messages several times a day, despite not actually doing anything themselves. The feedback from 'the product team' was that 'its normal'.

Is it possible to ask the same team what might trigger these messages, other than user action, and still be classed as 'normal'? They probably wouldn't have said 'normal' if they were thinking of wifi interference would they? (although I'm happy to consider anything)

[KeithFrench]

i @Anonymous 

I have commented quite a bit on this thread by @papd63 earlier on.

The WiFi security messages in the System Log are only generated when the WiFi settings are saved, but I have never seen them occurring when I have not done anything specific myself. Is Wi-Fi Optimisation enabled, it might be worth disabling it so that the OP has full control of his WiFi settings.

I would suggest that WiFi interference needs checking, I can't remember if I offered this before, or not.

[Anonymous]

Hello,

@KeithFrench - have you ever come across this before?

Thanks

[papd63]

Hi Debbie, thanks for your suggestion, although I think that my problem may be different to yours...

My printer(s) will always print successfully when first connected, whether on 2.4 or 5ghz. Its just that one or both printers become unreachable from some devices, at some (seemingly random) time after that, and I have to restart or disconnect/reconnect the printer to bring it back online. It turns out when a printer becomes unreachable from a device it always coincides with that device reconnecting to the network following the 'WiFi security settings...' messages, so the 'random' element is actually about when do those messages appear, and when does the source device next reconnect after that.

My printers do stay online longer when they are on 2g than when on they are on 5g. I believe that's because most of the 'WiFi security settings...' events seem to trigger all 2g devices (but not 5g devices) to disconnect and reconnect, so any printer on 2g which may have gone offline is immediately corrected, whereas any printer on 5g isn't. However keeping my printers on 2g isn't a solution because I still get some less frequent 'WiFi security settings...' events which seem to trigger all 5g devices (and no 2g devices) to disconnect and reconnect, so any 5g printer is corrected, whilst any 2g printer isn't.

Please can I take this opportunity to underline the thought behind my original question about what is the router doing, and why, when the 'WiFi security...' messages appear:
1) If I could understand the events which trigger the messages in my case, then I might be able to take action to prevent or reduce those events, or trigger my own corrective action following those events
2) I presume there's a reason why my router seems to trigger all 2g OR all 5g devices to disconnect and reconnect after these messages? But if so, I wonder why it wouldn't it trigger all 2g AND all 5g devices to reconnect at that point, because if it did, then I wouldn't have a problem at all?

Thanks again for your time.

[Debbie-TalkTalk]

Hi papd63

I had issues with my own printer, mine will only connect if I connect on 2ghz first.

If you connect to 2ghz first and then connect to the printer will it print ok?

[papd63]

Hi Chris,

Thanks for your question. No, I'm not using any wifi extenders.

[ Actually TalkTalk did send me a wifi extender recently, but its still in the box, unused. It was sent to me after I reported my Internet Status showing Disconnected via the online chat, which I mentioned in the penultimate paragraph of my previous post. It had nothing to do with the problem I reported, which I didn't get a fix for; but the agent said he could see some evidence of wifi problems and seemed desperate to do something useful, by which time I was desperate to end the chat without offending anyone, so I let him send me a wifi extender. As I say I haven't used it - if I do have any wifi coverage problems in our small house it will be at the furthest corner where I don't really need coverage. ]

To be clear, all of the tests I've been referencing in previous posts have been done with laptops and printers in the same room as the router i.e. within about 3 metres of it.

Since my post yesterday, there have been further groups of 'WiFi security...' messages in the router log at around 15:20, 16:03, 18:05, 18:51, 19:51, 21:36 yesterday, and 00:11, 01:10, 02:10, 03:11 (hourly?) this morning.

I restarted my router at 18:00 and my 5G-capable printer at 18:05 to start a new test. The router log shows my printer connecting just 9 seconds after the last message in the group at 18:05 above, so I'm wondering if there's a relationship?

After that the 5G-capable printer is shown in the router log as having remained connected with no disconnections, but my ping testing shows the printer became unreachable from a laptop which disconnected and reconnected to the router at 18:55:12 last night, whilst it remained pingable all night from a second laptop which stayed connected to the router. This printer remains pingable from one laptop and not the other now.

Chris, I wonder does your question imply that the 'WiFi security...' messages can occur as a consequence of wifi interference?

Thanks again.

[Chris-TalkTalk]

Hi papd63,

Are you using wifi extenders?

Chris